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butterfly
02-25-2004, 10:26 PM
Is it important for a married women to wear her thaali all the time?....wat is the significance of wearing the thaali?...Is it to let others know she is married...or is there anyother reasons???
Everyone Pls share ur views

Comenaughty
02-25-2004, 10:43 PM
a reply from the lighter side..... :ee:..... women shud wear mangalsutra's which is atleast 5-10 sovereigns...... else the chain snatchers association will start a strike/bandh..... :lol:

unique
02-25-2004, 11:19 PM
According to Indian tradition(atleast South Indian tradition),we consider THAALI as something sacred. Only widows r not allowed to wear THAALI,it is bcos purushane illainu pona aparam y that THAALI alone......But ippolam THAALI has become a fashion porul...venungara appo THAALI pottukardhu....vendadhappa kazhati vekardhu......Onna pottunda urupadiya pottukanam,illati pottukave koodadhu. Idhu enna cosmeticsa venungara appo apply pannara maadhiri.....

Well i might sound strange inmy thot....but that is me Unique,i wuld prefer married ladies. to wear THAALI all the time....One thing for wearing THAALI,is for others to know that she is married.....innum niraya beliefs irukku......theera aaraichi pannitu vandhu sollaren...

Enna Bfly enna yosikareenga :think: ...ennada naan enna kelvi keten iva enna badhil solli irukana...paravaillai adjust pannikongo...aparam eppo thaan ennoda thots naan solla mudiyum sollungo.... :wink:

Shy
02-26-2004, 12:35 AM
I second unique in this !!!!!

(1) Its not a fashion ornament. Thevaina pootukarthukku, ellaina kalati vaikka.. Shud know the importance of it. and respect it.

(2) Thaali should be worn by all married women. Not just to show others shes married but also to assure discipline.. oru varai murai irukanumnu kuuda thaan.. hope u all get my point. Genetically athunaala thaan guyskku yaethuvum ellai.. but for girlskku thaalinu onnu irukku.. because shes the root of any family and she shud be looked up....

Unique i too will search and post in here :)

Shy

sagi
02-26-2004, 01:40 AM
thaali is important to girls ....and i think may be guys should start to wear metti again :) rite shy?

RaasuKutty
02-26-2004, 01:42 AM
Is it important for a married women to wear her thaali all the time?....wat is the significance of wearing the thaali?...Is it to let others know she is married...or is there anyother reasons???
Everyone Pls share ur views


hiyoo butterfly,

neengaa tamil cinema paakaratheyyy illayaaa????? :00: :00: :00: :00: :00: :00: :00:
paakara palakkam illai nna sollungaa.... naan oru 10 movies sollaren... atha paathu thali meaning .. significance kathukoongaaa..

butterfly
02-26-2004, 03:07 AM
a reply from the lighter side..... ..... women shud wear mangalsutra's which is atleast 5-10 sovereigns...... else the chain snatchers association will start a strike/bandh.....


Duhhh naughty...in that case all poli samiyars will be in jail :)...appadiyavathu naadu urupadum :)



Enna Bfly enna yosikareenga ...ennada naan enna kelvi keten iva enna badhil solli irukana...paravaillai adjust pannikongo...aparam eppo thaan ennoda thots naan solla mudiyum sollungo....


unique,
was expecting answers in different angles...everyone has their own opinion...& wanted to bringforth a topic where everyones view can be shared :)



Unique i too will search and post in here


Thanks shy



thaali is important to girls ....and i think may be guys should start to wear metti again rite shy?


Lets leave metti alone now sagi...will start another topic about it :)

hiyoo butterfly,



neengaa tamil cinema paakaratheyyy illayaaa?????
paakara palakkam illai nna sollungaa.... naan oru 10 movies sollaren... atha paathu thali meaning .. significance kathukoongaaa..


Raasukutty,
Movie ellam venam...unga karuthai sollungo :)

many of u said it has traditional values ...true....but its a reminder for whom?...



One thing for wearing THAALI,is for others to know that she is married.....

If we are following this...how many of us wear our thaali outside when we go to work or for shopping & stuff ?...am talking about ppl living outside India & SL



2) Thaali should be worn by all married women. Not just to show others shes married but also to assure discipline..


In this case ...shudnt discipline come frm ones heart?..rather than believing on thaali?

RaasuKutty
02-26-2004, 05:01 AM
Raasukutty,
Movie ellam venam...unga karuthai sollungo

many of u said it has traditional values ...true....but its a reminder for whom?...


en kadaya sollanumaa..

pasanga ellarum kalyanam aana apparum nalla pasangala adangi iruppangaa... but ponnungalukku oru chinna reminder kodukka thaan nnu vechukoongaa..... :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: ...

(sorry for disturbing the real course....)

real significance enakku theriaathu....

katteri
02-26-2004, 12:00 PM
Rombha interesting topic.. i met a person who is a tamil poet...who has done research in tamil culture..
He says the reason behind wearing meti is to produce sound so that the person who see s her reckons she s married..
In olden days people used to see girls leg first to know whether she married..(piran maniviya parkaakoodathu nu)
So thaliku munnadi metti irukku aaana... enna karano mo theiryalai thali mavusu athigam ayudichu may be its made in gold ....(some thali r with tumeric & rope)

Thali sentiment padam niraiya irukku ....Aana metti sentiment la oru padam koooda varala paa...

sagi
02-26-2004, 12:04 PM
varalinna enna..neenga eduthitta porguthu ;)

but metti is for men...not for women.. :)

katteri
02-26-2004, 12:09 PM
varalinna enna..neenga eduthitta porguthu ;)

but metti is for men...not for women.. :)

Sagi veliyalaaa solatheenghaaa. metti yaar pottukitu irukanghaaa,,,,aaa

suha
02-26-2004, 12:35 PM
thalali na yenna means .............(mangal sutrru)...............but muslims thali kata matta.........appo yenna saiyeeeee :wink: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :sm12: :clap: :clap: :clap:

dinesh
02-26-2004, 01:12 PM
In this case ...shudnt discipline come frm ones heart?..rather than believing on thaali?

Indeed, there is no point in wearing an ornament if there is no true loyalty.

There is some traditional meaning why Thali is worn, basically I think thali is to remind the people concerned about their union. Metti is to let others know one is married. Incidentialli, Metti was worn by men in the older days. It is to inform other women that the guy is married. And the story goes on to say that since women always walk with their head bowed, ie looking down, an ornament worn in the feet would be ideal to get the message across.

anainar
02-26-2004, 01:22 PM
Pattaams,

All the time wearing thaali? That may be a bit of overdoing. No one needs an ornament to remind themselves that they are married. For other who look at them to know that they are married a good reason to wear it. It might avoid unpleasant events, especially for good looking girls.

To be hones, I dont know the real reason behind thaali if at there is one apart from the above one. One thought that came to my mind though. Gold is a important ingradient for good health. "Thangabaspam" kelvi pattu iruppeengalay? So, may it is to make sure that the women were some gold ornament rubbing them, there by providing the necessary gold ?

Doc Sofi kooda illai, illaati vanthu solluvaango ethavathu.

Cheers

Bluelotus
02-26-2004, 02:20 PM
but muslims thali kata matta.........appo yenna saiyeeeee
Interesting to know....cos I have seen many SL Tamil Christian Ladies wearing it. I know it is a Hindu symbol...but sort of assumed that like the Pottu/Bindhi it had become part of Tamil tradition...

Wasn't thaali originally just a sacred rope ....hence u get the 3 knots.....I wonder how long ago it changed from being just a sacred turmeric rope to a golden sacred "necklace"...I mean there is even a "melting of the gold" ceremony right?



women shud wear mangalsutra's which is atleast 5-10 sovereigns...... else the chain snatchers association will start a strike/bandh....

It really has moved on from being a religious or traditional symbol...to being a fashion accessory (then again so has the plain wedding band exchanged during Christian ceremonies)....They even have very fancy ones now days.....and have u noticed how diferent states/nations have their own unique Mangala sutra....north Indians I heard have one made out of gold and onyx, etc..

(just wondering how many ppl's feet can u see now days...considering tht most ppl wear shoes...so u can't really see anybody's methi be they male or female)

unique
02-26-2004, 07:26 PM
We r comparing western countries for so many things.....idhuleyum compare pannalame.....western countries they exchange Wedding rings(in marriage),the couples never remove their Wedding rings until they r divorced or either of them ceases(this is known to everyone). They don t wear it whenever they want or remove it whenever they want.Ivangale Wedding ringku ivalavu importance tharum podhu. Also they wear it so that others culd see that they r no longer available.

Namba who respect family n traditional values,namba yen Thaaliku madhipu thara koodadhu sollunga........

Engeyo paarthen indha topic

Tying a thaali is the most important ceremony in Indian marriages. It is similar to the Western custom of exchanging rings. Every Indian woman consider thaali as the most prestigious token of love offered to her by her husband during the ceremony.

In Tamil Nadu and in a few other states, Thaali's are tied on a thick yellow thread. When the thread is worn out, they are replaced by a new thread. Generally, in the northern states Mangalsutra is made of two strings of black beads. These beads are believed to protect the marriage against evil. Thaali's of different shapes and sizes are used by different communities based on their particular customs. Thaali is considered auspicious by the married women and they wear it till their death or their husband's death.

butterfly
02-26-2004, 07:40 PM
Pattaams,



For other who look at them to know that they are married a good reason to wear it. It might avoid unpleasant events, especially for good looking girls.

how many married women wear their thaali outside when working??



We r comparing western countries for so many things.....idhuleyum compare pannalame.....western countries they exchange Wedding rings(in marriage),the couples never remove their Wedding rings until they r divorced or either of them ceases(this is known to everyone). They don t wear it whenever they want or remove it whenever they want.Ivangale Wedding ringku ivalavu importance tharum podhu. Also they wear it so that others culd see that they r no longer available.


unique,
A ring is visible...anyone can notice it...nowadays gals start wearing rings earlier...to let others know they are engaged...to avoid men asking them out...its a way of protecting themself now...



Indeed, there is no point in wearing an ornament if there is no true loyalty.

shidinesh,
I know of ppl who may not look @ the thaali as something which bonds her to her man...she just looks @ it as an ornament thats all...its the love which is between them which is more imp...also have seen somewomen who wont remove it for even a sec...so wanted to know if there is anything wrong if the person forgets to wear it...does it anyway affect her husband

one eg solren
say she had to go to the hospital...& had to remove all her jewellery...when she comes back she didnt bother to put any jewels back on...she didnt think about misrespecting the Thaali or her husband...was she wrong ??

Bluelotus
02-26-2004, 07:47 PM
See I heard tht Mangala/Mangalya sutra is not a common practice in Norther n India except in Gujarat and Maharashtra....so it's not common to all Indians then is it?
I obvioulsy don't know how true this is

I don't think the Tying of the Managala sutra is the most important thing in a wedding...it is the vows they make to each other which is, in my opinion.
Isn't the following far more important?


Saptapadi

The bride and groom take seven steps together, symbolizing the beginning of their journey through life as partners. These seven steps reflect their guiding principles in life. As they take each step, the bride and groom exchange the following vows:

Together we will:

Share in the responsibility of the home

Fill our hearts with strength and courage

Prosper and share our worldly goods

Fill our hearts with love, peace, happiness, and spiritual values

Be blessed with loving children

Attain self-restraint and longevity

Be best friends and eternal partners


from: http://www.sanskrit.org/Rites%20of%20Passage/wedding.html

But I do agree tht if the thaali is tied then it should be worn....perhaps ppl should consider really light ones....less gold...so less heavy and less conspicuous...so u don't have the thieves guild after u. :wink:

gokulan42
02-26-2004, 07:58 PM
Pattaams,



For other who look at them to know that they are married a good reason to wear it. It might avoid unpleasant events, especially for good looking girls.

how many married women wear their thaali outside when working??
Not much to my knowledge. And, why do they?




We r comparing western countries for so many things.....idhuleyum compare pannalame.....western countries they exchange Wedding rings(in marriage),the couples never remove their Wedding rings until they r divorced or either of them ceases(this is known to everyone). They don t wear it whenever they want or remove it whenever they want.Ivangale Wedding ringku ivalavu importance tharum podhu. Also they wear it so that others culd see that they r no longer available.


unique,
A ring is visible...anyone can notice it...nowadays gals start wearing rings earlier...to let others know they are engaged...to avoid men asking them out...its a way of protecting themself now...
I know a lot of my friends who remove their rings before the game (all sorts). Ring is just to let everbody know that he/she is taken. In our culture, thali is claimed to have monumental values that that and there is no equivalent for guys (I like that part - kidding). I dont want to offend any religious feelings here (FYI, I am strong & devoted hindu for all its positives). But, this should not be mandatory. But, it is fun to have all those functions that comes with it. And, we should keep the fun part.




Indeed, there is no point in wearing an ornament if there is no true loyalty.

shidinesh,
I know of ppl who may not look @ the thaali as something which bonds her to her man...she just looks @ it as an ornament thats all...its the love which is between them which is more imp...also have seen somewomen who wont remove it for even a sec...so wanted to know if there is anything wrong if the person forgets to wear it...does it anyway affect her husband

one eg solren
say she had to go to the hospital...& had to remove all her jewellery...when she comes back she didnt bother to put any jewels back on...she didnt think about misrespecting the Thaali or her husband...was she wrong ??[/quote]
Excellant, butterfly. I will go one step further in saying that Thali should be optionally worn as an ornament and should not hold any holdings that comes with it. I find it amazing that there are guys (Anainar & me) supporting the 'thali-against' team and lots of females are supporting 'thali-for' team.

Well, thats India.

Teena
02-26-2004, 07:58 PM
I don't know whether thali is important to wear all the time or not but I would say ring is a perfect identification for both men and women .I also like to say whether it is thali/chain or ring or whatever the identification mark both men and women should wear .

vasan
02-26-2004, 08:15 PM
I am just thinking about this whole identification thingy.. why do one need to KNOW if I am married or not? Why should it be an issue.. You see, some time back we changed from Miss and Mrs to a more generic Ms, as a more (polically) correct title for a women. In the same vein, why on earth do I have to IDENTIFY myself as a married man? Whats next? Nethiyila pachchai kuthikkarathunnu practice arrambichuduvaangala?

Culturally if people have been doing it and because of that if some one wants to do it, then its fine. But should it go away from practice, like the 'metti-for-married-men' practice, perhaps it should..

I don't know if 'thaali' per se has any religious significance (too little knowledge on religious matters). I do know that many indian christians wear thaali, and many tamil muslims wearing some ornament (black, beaded stuff) and apparently they know who is married and not..... I have no knowledge beyond this, so I will not talk about it much any more. But I will say this: If it is only an identification for the world to know, well, I will do what I want to do and the world can make its mind about me.. !!

I still have a lot of teenage rebellious spirit, inspite of adding another 60 or so years.. :)

Vasan

dinesh
02-26-2004, 08:21 PM
Butterfly, you got me wrong there. I meant that just by wearing an ornament a woman is not going to develop any sort of loyalty/love to the husband. It should be more than enough if one had that love deep in their heart. You don't need to wear an ornament to show it.

Vasan, I think the identification thing was there so that another man/woman may not lust a married man/woman even by accident. Hence a signal was needed to be sent out. A bit like placing a "reserved" note on a restaurant table, if you get what I mean ;)

gokulan42
02-26-2004, 08:22 PM
I don't know whether thali is important to wear all the time or not but I would say ring is a perfect identification for both men and women .I also like to say whether it is thali/chain or ring or whatever the identification mark both men and women should wear .

I agree, Sivam. You gave of breif of what I was trying to say there :)

Vasan, excellant post. I very much like everything you said there.

dinesh
02-26-2004, 08:26 PM
And about removing a Thali, I don't think it's much of an issue. We can't obviously compare it to a ring because it is more heavier than a ring and has a weird shaped pendant. So we have to think how comfortable it is wearing it all the time. I don't like even wearing a thin chain (which partially contributes to my general dislike of jewellery), because I don't feel very comfortable with it.
Without getting too vulgar, I'll point to a particular scene in "Alaipayuthe" to force my point why it's not always comfortable wear a Thali. This is a general opinion (and from a person whov'e never worn one, obviously) so please don't bring out all those "How could you say so about the most sacred thing" dialogues. Please.

Teena
02-26-2004, 08:31 PM
Shidinesh I totally agree to all your points.Well said.

vasan
02-26-2004, 09:04 PM
Vasan, I think the identification thing was there so that another man/woman may not lust a married man/woman even by accident. Hence a signal was needed to be sent out. A bit like placing a "reserved" note on a restaurant table, if you get what I mean ;)

On the lighter side.. (even if its a rather crude..).. then I would think the thaali has not really worked out well, failed its job and all that... don't you think so.. :wink: :wink: :lol: :lol:

But yeah, I go :oops: :oops: hmm.. what a luck.. when I notice the ring.. !! What is worse, these days every girl (who looks like) above 21 seems to be wearing a ring..

I hate and dread the Ring lot more than Frodo Baggins.. :D :D :D :D

Sorry about the jokes Butterfly.. :pray:

Vasan

dinesh
02-26-2004, 09:14 PM
then I would think the thaali has not really worked out well, failed its job and all that... don't you think so..

The fault is not with the Thaali. Is it? So can't blame the Thaali.


What is worse, these days every girl (who looks like) above 21 seems to be wearing a ring..

I think you are in the wrong place dude. Sabeshan sonna maathiri you should go to Maine, then. :sm12:



Sorry about the jokes Butterfly..

Don't worry. Avanga thittinaalum Hindi-la thaan thittuvaanga....romba perukku puriyaathu :b:

butterfly
02-26-2004, 10:26 PM
Don't worry. Avanga thittinaalum Hindi-la thaan thittuvaanga....romba perukku puriyaathu

:b: :ahha:



But yeah, I go hmm.. what a luck.. when I notice the ring.. !! What is worse, these days every girl (who looks like) above 21 seems to be wearing a ring..

Guess wat??.....its working :)

enge venky,sri,& others...pls come & share ur knowledge too

venky1974
02-26-2004, 10:59 PM
Guys,

Thaali Or Mangalyam or Mangalsutra is a thread that combines a Man and Women in Wedlock. Even though a woman wears, it to show that she is now married and has to be given and treated with respect in the society.

No one here talked about the verse that is said when a man ties it .(Note: this is not a mantra its just a verse)

mAngalyam tantunAnena mama jIvanA hethunA |
kaNThe: badhnami subhage! sanjIva Sarada: Satam ||

Which means::

This is a sacred thread. This is essential for my long life. I tie this around your neck, O maiden having many auspicious attributes! May you live happily for a hundred years (with me)

Source:: Ramanuja.org

It is very important for a women to wear the Mangalsutra at all time throughout her life as a married women.

This sutra is blessed by all the family and friends who have blessed the couple during their marriage. It is not a mere ornament, but a string with very high power when respected.

The sutra should never be touched by any one apart from the person wearing it. It is not a show off thing.

I do understand that with this generation being highly educated and all and science being so advanced asking one to question and explain each and every aspect in life, there are things that need to be followed as tradition,as if not followed you dont have a tradition or culture left.

Every year (atleast in the community I come from) women change the thaali kodi due to wear and tear and it is quite a task to do it. It has to be done in such a fasion that the loop does not break. such is the value of the sutra in our culture.

The Marriage is not complete when the Mangalya Dharanam takes place. The marriage is completed when Paani Grahanam is completed when the Maiden's hand is given in the hand of the boy. The mantra says:

The Devas have offered you to me in order that I may live the life of a householder -
"Grihastha", we shall not part from each other even after we grow old"

Cheers,

unique
02-26-2004, 11:07 PM
Good points venky.......

dinesh
02-26-2004, 11:07 PM
Good explanation Venky :clap:


I do understand that with this generation being highly educated and all and science being so advanced asking one to question and explain each and every aspect in life, there are things that need to be followed as tradition,as if not followed you dont have a tradition or culture left.

I have to disagree with this, however. I do understand and respect your belief in tradition. Because it's your choice, and you have the right to choose whatever you want to. But, at the same time, can't I choose what I want to believe? How can you say traditions cannot be questioned and have to be followed by everybody? It is my choice whether I want to believe in something or not. Isn't it? How can that not be respected?
Furthermore, how can you define culture as what you believe and expect others to follow it? I may be following a different culture, or might have developed my own culture to complement my lifestyle. So, am I wrong to follow that culture, just because it contradicts with your way of thinking?

These are all hypothetical questions, BTW, so please don't take it as a personal attack.... :pray:

butterfly
02-26-2004, 11:10 PM
Thanks Venky...for explaining...


This is a sacred thread. This is essential for my long life. I tie this around your neck, O maiden having many auspicious attributes! May you live happily for a hundred years (with me)


This makes sense..Y in hindu religion they take away the thaali once the husband dies...
I dont think in christain & muslim religion they do that...once a women is married she goes to her grave with her thaali

venky1974
02-26-2004, 11:25 PM
have to disagree with this, however. I do understand and respect your belief in tradition. Because it's your choice, and you have the right to choose whatever you want to. But, at the same time, can't I choose what I want to believe?


Dinesh, Very good question and very good point.

Let me put it this way. You are a differnt person and so am I . like you said you have the freedom to choose what ever you want and yes by all means stick to it.

It is a tradition in our country to respect our elders. I believe in this and it gives me peace in doing it. Some people may feel differently and question that fact. It is up to them.

Though I respect your opinions and your thinking, My belief is that our elders long long long ago have developed a way of life which has been highly researched and which was given a name culture & tradition. We ought to follow it that is all I want to say about it.



So, am I wrong to follow that culture, just because it contradicts your way of thinking?


Absolutely not. We would not have so many cultures and religions if there were no contradictions. Its the way you are brought up and its the way you have decided to stick to and the person is matured enough to sense the good in it then dont care what I say casue you believe in something and that something is your freedom and no one can question that.



These are all hypothetical questions, BTW, so please don't take it as a personal attack....


Enna ba Dinesh, we are all in the same team..how can I take your opinions as a attack.. sool dude.



Quote:

This is a sacred thread. This is essential for my long life. I tie this around your neck, O maiden having many auspicious attributes! May you live happily for a hundred years (with me)



This makes sense..Y in hindu religion they take away the thaali once the husband dies...
I dont think in christain & muslim religion they do that...once a women is married she goes to her grave with her thaali


Pattams,

Bolded area.. if the person who tied it itself is no longer there then what use is the thaali.. I am not sure of the Christian and Muslim Rituals..

The thaali is never removed if the women dies first... that is called Sumangali..right and is that not what all women pray for so that they never have to see the day when someone removes the thaali from them...

I am no expert hence I have pointed out what I thoguht.. No offence to any one..

cheers,

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 01:12 AM
Though I respect your opinions and your thinking, My belief is that our elders long long long ago have developed a way of life which has been highly researched and which was given a name culture & tradition. We ought to follow it that is all I want to say about it.
Venky, I love and respect the love you love our religion. However, I differe with you at the 'blindly following' part. 'Pazhaiyana kalithalum, puthiyana puhuthalum...' was also told way back by elders. Why are we not doing that. If something that was said in the past is not applicable, the religion/culture should be flexible enough to accomadate that. 'Sati' was devloped as a way of life long back by our elders. Can we follow that now?


Quote: This is a sacred thread. This is essential for my long life. I tie this around your neck, O maiden having many auspicious attributes! May you live happily for a hundred years (with me)
Bolded area.. if the person who tied it itself is no longer there then what use is the thaali..
The thaali is never removed if the women dies first... that is called Sumangali..right and is that not what all women pray for so that they never have to see the day when someone removes the thaali from them...

Do you see the contradictions here? I will ask the same question that you asked here (
in a different way ofcourse). if the person who got tied is no longer there then what use is the thaali (in case of sumangali example)?

I want our religion and culture (any religion and culture for that matter) to be flexible enough to change if warranted. If not, then what is the difference between you and an islamic terrorist?

Disclaimer: My intention is not to hurt anybody here. Please do not take it personal. I have nothing against any religion or culture. I love them all :)

venky1974
02-27-2004, 06:52 AM
I want our religion and culture (any religion and culture for that matter) to be flexible enough to change if warranted. If not, then what is the difference between you and an islamic terrorist?


Gokulan,

First of all your disclaimer does not work here. Period. If you have nothing against any religion then you have no right to say Islamic Terrorist. A terrorist is a terrorist, if he is Islamic/hindu/sikh etc..If you want to talk about it we can start a new topic on that so lets not get into that. Ok va :b:



If something that was said in the past is not applicable, the religion/culture should be flexible enough to accomadate that. 'Sati' was devloped as a way of life long back by our elders. Can we follow that now?

Again...It is upto a person to take intrest in his faith/culture/tradition. If i love and you don't love that is my freedom to choose and no one can question that. I am not sure if Sati was developed by elders??? Sati...was abolished and people are happy which is good.. but have you read that in the past when the husband dies the wife voluntarily used to embrace the fire as the sati says that its the warmth of her husband and it does not burn her.



if the person who got tied is no longer there then what use is the thaali


Ask a married lady how important is that Taali to her? If you don't get the answer I will explain. Taali is an integral part of a Married women. No one can touch that when she is still married. When a woman is married the most important blessing she seeks is to be sumangali all her life and if she passes as a sumangali then that taali is a blessed taali which a man can only question and not understand.(Sorry guys..there are some things for which the importance can only be estimated by a women and not men)





I want our religion and culture (any religion and culture for that matter) to be flexible enough to change if warranted

Sure enough...it does sound good but is it possible??? There are certain rules and regulations that are to be RESPECTED upon which a religion or culture is based, if that itself is changed then a new religion/culture arises... A human is free to choose what he likes, and if the Religion/culture he is in does not allow the freedom he seeks he is free to move on, but leave alone what others want to follow. (That is their freedom) There are positives and negatives for every thing in life.. that is what creates the perfect balance, the circle of life. You win some you loose some.Profit - Loss -Pain - gain happiness -sorrow- day-night, summer - winter... good perople Bad people...

Cheers,

reks
02-27-2004, 10:12 AM
Metti, i think, theres a nerve that connects the second finger of the toe to the heart, and it passes thru the uterus... so, whn u walk, this metti causes a friction, which regulates the blood pressure etc and is supposed to revitalize the reproductive organs... thou i cant imagine why men wore metti in olden days :think:

Am sure Thali has some such significance too... i know, in general wearing gold is good for your body... it helps regularize blood circulation etc...

Otherwise if thaali is worn just for identification purpose and for sending out warning signals :wink:, then mabbe we should rethink...

but, thaali signifies a bond between the man and the wife, and should be given due respect and should not be treated like a ordinary ornament. It has to be treasured. Thou i dont think, its a big sin, if you choose not to wear it daily.


Venky, your explanations are good.. :)


Though I respect your opinions and your thinking, My belief is that our elders long long long ago have developed a way of life which has been highly researched and which was given a name culture & tradition. We ought to follow it that is all I want to say about it.

but I beg to differ here... am sure, even you dont follow all the traditions which our elders had devised long ago ... there are many traditions, culture which we have choosen not to follow or modify according to our current lifestyle... so eventually its upto the individuals... and ofcourse, as u say, nobody can question anybody :)



but have you read that in the past when the husband dies the wife voluntarily used to embrace the fire as the sati says that its the warmth of her husband and it does not burn her.

if its true, no offense or insult meant.. but i think it was more due to the fear they had towards facing life thereafter, than due to the love for their husbands(once again, no insult meant towards the love or respect they had for their husbands... Why, Men never did sati, when their wives died... that doesnt mean they didnt hv enuf luv for their wives).
Nyways, one reason was, women were not allowed to work and so they had to be dependent on somebody else.. Here we shd also take into consideration the fact that, her parents wont be around for long... Two in any case, sure she wasnt allowed to lead a active life in any aspect after that...
so apdi irukarathuku ithuvae mel nenaichirkalam... so suthi valachu patha, they were forced to accept it, one way or other... :)
(one more reason i can think of is, those days widows had to motta adichify... :()




I dont think in christain & muslim religion they do that
Tamil nadu, most of the christians dont wear thalli or keep bindhi after their husbands death... thou its not as strict as in hindu culture...

vasan
02-27-2004, 10:23 AM
Metti, i think, theres a nerve that connects the second finger of the toe to the heart, and it passes thru the uterus... so, whn u walk, this metti causes a friction, which regulates the blood pressure etc and is supposed to revitalize the reproductive organs... thou i cant imagine why men wore metti in olden days

Am sure Thali has some such significance too... i know, in general wearing gold is good for your body... it helps regularize blood circulation etc...



Great arguments and excellent points. However, just a bit of correction, Reks..

Not true scientifically. Wearing metal (gold or pithallai.. !!) is not beneficial healthwise, its only ornamental. (Ofcourse you can argue, it helps boost self confidence and therefore positive for a person's holistic welfare and all that.. I can't say much on that :D )... Same about the metti also.. No medically proven use. Not a bit.

Its only our wishful thinking, and our innate desire to find something good about every one of our practices.... Medically no use. If people want to wear it for other reasons, well, so be it.. !!

No offense folks. But science is science. Medical facts are medical facts.

Vasan

anainar
02-27-2004, 01:29 PM
Wow! What started as a general discussion has gone to the extent of terrorism.

Ennaappa Guku, ippadi solliteenga? Terrorists athu ithunnu. This is not a religeous fight. I dont know whether christian/muslic women wear thaali at allDo they?. I have seen Maharashtrian women wear thaali which is not made of gold like ours, but a a mix of black color beads(paasi) and gold mixed together. So, the logic of medicinal reasons may not hold water. Mallus wear a different kind of chain which dont even look like thaali.

So basically it all boils down to beliefs. But Reks, like you said things are changing and so does our beliefs and traditions. One of the reasons for sati might be as you said, women being scared of facing their life alone. Not anymore with women being much stronger now. So, whether we accept or not, it is more of a sybmbolism that, "Hey, I have my guy"

Another thing I noticed though, when ever my mom does pooja or goes to the temple, a small bit of the kumkum or viboothi on the thaali. I remember asking her once, she gave me "Oh! you grown up guy" looks, and told, "your dad is not with us right now. I prayed for him and gave him this prasad".

Isnt that a wonderful feeling to be remembered by the loved one? If it means wearing thaali for 24x7, why should we question that?

Cheers

vasan
02-27-2004, 01:34 PM
hmm Come to think of it, some of the poorer (financially only!!) friends of mine have married with manjal kayiru, and one dry piece of manjal as their thaali. Gold is not affordable.. No metallic benefits.. !!

unique
02-27-2004, 03:33 PM
Metti, i think, theres a nerve that connects the second finger of the toe to the heart, and it passes thru the uterus... so, whn u walk, this metti causes a friction, which regulates the blood pressure etc and is supposed to revitalize the reproductive organs

Me too read this article somewhere..............well now i ll to do some aaraichi to find out if it is true........

Honeyarjun
02-27-2004, 03:42 PM
As butterfly pointed out..women need to remove thali when they go to medical checkup(inside the operation theatre and during x-ray).. Will they say NO for removing the Thali there?? what happens to the belief..thali should be worn all the time till death(if sumangali) arent they removing it depending upon the situations?? People who say I will not remove my Thali and will wear it all the time...will you say it to the Doc even when you go into the operation theatre??? If the women remove Thali for even a min or for even short duration...it actually contradicts the original belief behind this custom ..

No offense to anyone here... In my opinion... Thali is just an ornament..and only the trust between the couple should bond them together for their entire life.. Ring, Thali are all just physical things ..we neednt convey to anyone that we are married.. We are not living in sanga kalam anymore so that we protect ourselves from men by using Thali.. People are matured now and they wont propose instantly on seeing the woman......

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 03:59 PM
If you have nothing against any religion then you have no right to say Islamic Terrorist. A terrorist is a terrorist, if he is Islamic/hindu/sikh etc..If you want to talk about it we can start a new topic on that so lets not get into that. Ok va

Have you heard about 'freedom of speech'. A terrorist is a terrorist and no religion attached to it. But, most of the terrorists have religion or culture or race attached to their 'cause'. I said islamic terrorists as they are more popular than others and there is nothing else to it (I apologize to any muslim friends, if they were hurt by these comments). Open a new thread and I am more than willing to 'actively' participate. And, I generally try to do that without hurting anybody.


Again...It is upto a person to take intrest in his faith/culture/tradition. If i love and you don't love that is my freedom to choose and no one can question that. I am not sure if Sati was developed by elders??? Sati...was abolished and people are happy which is good.. but have you read that in the past when the husband dies the wife voluntarily used to embrace the fire as the sati says that its the warmth of her husband and it does not burn her.
NOOOO! Its not upto a person to commit sati now. Whether the wife is interested or not it does not matter. Its a crime, period.


Ask a married lady how important is that Taali to her? If you don't get the answer I will explain. Taali is an integral part of a Married women. No one can touch that when she is still married. When a woman is married the most important blessing she seeks is to be sumangali all her life and if she passes as a sumangali then that taali is a blessed taali which a man can only question and not understand.(Sorry guys..there are some things for which the importance can only be estimated by a women and not men)
No wonder ;) In your response for sati, you said those ladies were thinking sacred and voluntary and you conveniently ignore those who did not want to go sati or wear thali. But, ours was very much a male dominated society (like islamic or western) and women were made to beleive that way (No disrespect to ladies here). Now, the majority of females do not think sacred about sati and they will think the same way about other unwarranted followings too.


Sure enough...it does sound good but is it possible??? There are certain rules and regulations that are to be RESPECTED upon which a religion or culture is based, if that itself is changed then a new religion/culture arises... A human is free to choose what he likes, and if the Religion/culture he is in does not allow the freedom he seeks he is free to move on, but leave alone what others want to follow.
I will say the same in a different way. If 'some of the rules and regulations that were respected in the past is no longer applicable' concept is agreed by a majority of people who follow that religion/culture, then the religion and culture is modernized (like hinduism without sati, white dress and so on). Those who do want to follow the old tradition do so (if not arrested for crimes like sati) stay there and they have the freedom to identify themselves as the old culture/religion (here hinduism I guess).


but I beg to differ here... am sure, even you dont follow all the traditions which our elders had devised long ago ... there are many traditions, culture which we have choosen not to follow or modify according to our current lifestyle... so eventually its upto the individuals... and ofcourse, as u say, nobody can question anybody
I agree with your point here. But, the reverse of the same does not work and should not work. If an individual wants to do sati, he should not be allowed as we collectively decided it is a crime. Here, the individual's freedom is no more important than the society.

Reks, I agree with your point on sati. It was a sad and horrible practice and I cant beleive Venky's comments myself. Self-denial does not do any good to the religion or culture. Rather we find, accept and eliminate is a better method to preserve the religion and culture for all the positives it provides.


Ennaappa Guku, ippadi solliteenga? Terrorists athu ithunnu. This is not a religeous fight. I dont know whether christian/muslic women wear thaali at allDo they?. I have seen Maharashtrian women wear thaali which is not made of gold like ours, but a a mix of black color beads(paasi) and gold mixed together. So, the logic of medicinal reasons may not hold water. Mallus wear a different kind of chain which dont even look like thaali.
Anainar, I said terrorists in a different context. The religion does not matter (unfortunately, most of these terrorists takre religion or race for it). And, regarding thali, even if its good medically, if a woman decides not to wear it and take alternative medicines (if required), she should be allowed to do that. Just giving medical reasons behind an unwarranted practice does not justify the practice itself.

Vasan, good points. thanks.

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 04:02 PM
Metti, i think, theres a nerve that connects the second finger of the toe to the heart, and it passes thru the uterus... so, whn u walk, this metti causes a friction, which regulates the blood pressure etc and is supposed to revitalize the reproductive organs

Me too read this article somewhere..............well now i ll to do some aaraichi to find out if it is true........

I would like to know about the metti too. But, please open a new thread on that and it will help so many people who still wears it :) The details about metti here may leads to a diversion from an very interesting discussion on thali. It is my opinion :)

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 04:07 PM
As butterfly pointed out..women need to remove thali when they go to medical checkup(inside the operation theatre and during x-ray).. Will they say NO for removing the Thali there?? what happens to the belief..thali should be worn all the time till death(if sumangali) arent they removing it depending upon the situations?? People who say I will not remove my Thali and will wear it all the time...will you say it to the Doc even when you go into the operation theatre??? If the women remove Thali for even a min or for even short duration...it actually contradicts the original belief behind this custom ..

No offense to anyone here... In my opinion... Thali is just an ornament..and only the trust between the couple should bond them together for their entire life.. Ring, Thali are all just physical things ..we neednt convey to anyone that we are married.. We are not living in sanga kalam anymore so that we protect ourselves from men by using Thali.. People are matured now and they wont propose instantly on seeing the woman......

Venky suggested to ask some females for the value of thali. Well, you said it all. And, I strongly agree with you here.

Every single comment of yours make sense to me. However, there is nothing wrong in wearing thali as an ornament, whenever ladies choos to wear it.

sagi
02-27-2004, 04:37 PM
இதெல்லாம் மனது சம்பந்தப்ப ட்ட விடயம்.. சொன்னால் புரியாது :sm05:

venky1974
02-27-2004, 04:40 PM
Have you heard about 'freedom of speech'. A terrorist is a terrorist and no religion attached to it. But, most of the terrorists have religion or culture or race attached to their 'cause'. I said islamic terrorists as they are more popular than others and there is nothing else to it (I apologize to any muslim friends, if they were hurt by these comments). Open a new thread and I am more than willing to 'actively' participate. And, I generally try to do that without hurting anybody.

Let's not even go there. It is not a healthy topic in a public forum so lets just leave it here and forget.



I will say the same in a different way. If some of the rules and regulations that were respected in the past is no longer applicable concept is agreed by a majority of people who follow that religion/culture, then the religion and culture is modernized (like hinduism without sati, white dress and so on). Those who do want to follow the old tradition do so (if not arrested for crimes like sati) stay there and they have the freedom to identify themselves as the old culture/religion (here hinduism I guess).


First, Sati is abolished and is one of the good things that India has done. Hinduism does not say to perform sati. Somewhere along the line one started and it went on as a chain and it carried on till Raja Ram Mohan Roy took a stand and got a revolution and got it abolished,

I respect the values that I follow which was imparted by my elders and if you want to call me old fashioned on it, please be my Guest and I care none about any one on that. Its my freedom to choose. You may be Ultra Modern and be it , that is your freedom.



Honeyarjun wrote:
As butterfly pointed out..women need to remove thali when they go to medical checkup(inside the operation theatre and during x-ray).. Will they say NO for removing the Thali there?? what happens to the belief..thali should be worn all the time till death(if sumangali) arent they removing it depending upon the situations?? People who say I will not remove my Thali and will wear it all the time...will you say it to the Doc even when you go into the operation theatre??? If the women remove Thali for even a min or for even short duration...it actually contradicts the original belief behind this custom ..

No offense to anyone here... In my opinion... Thali is just an ornament..and only the trust between the couple should bond them together for their entire life.. Ring, Thali are all just physical things ..we neednt convey to anyone that we are married.. We are not living in sanga kalam anymore so that we protect ourselves from men by using Thali.. People are matured now and they wont propose instantly on seeing the woman......


Venky suggested to ask some females for the value of thali. Well, you said it all. And, I strongly agree with you here.

Every single comment of yours make sense to me. However, there is nothing wrong in wearing thali as an ornament, whenever ladies choos to wear it.


Guys, Operating Room and X Rays are cases where you cant help it, These are situations when your whole life is at risk, So don't mix that with wearing Thaali.

I appreciate all your opinions and these are your opinions and the above said are mine, our opinions do not change some one's belief. So if some women feels that Thaali is very important to her please do not argue on that fact. Its their belief and they might get hurt about it. Respect it and then youwill realize the power it has. Its not a mere ornament as per me.

I will not join any more debate on this topic. I have put forth my opinion and my opinion is what i believe.

Cheers,

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 05:26 PM
First, Sati is abolished and is one of the good things that India has done. Hinduism does not say to perform sati. Somewhere along the line one started and it went on as a chain and it carried on till Raja Ram Mohan Roy took a stand and got a revolution and got it abolished,
Venky, where does it say that thali was created when the religion was found and sati was not. I am not saying Hinduism says to perform sati and I like it. Most of these unwarranted followings were created somewhere along the line and IMO we should try to ignore those.

If a lady can remove thali at the hospital why not at other places. We need the maximum support in the hospital than other places. If thali is much more than an ornament or an medical equipment, should we not wear it in the hospital.

Nobody is trying to change your beleives here. Atlast I am not going to try that. If one beleives to wear thali all the time (if she thinks it is more than an ornament), she is free to do so. But, it should be flexible to those who may not want to wear it all the times.

It was nice discussing this topic with you. I admire your honesty as not many people who beleive the way you feel would come and say this in a public forum. Your posts have lots of good values that others can learn from and I appreciate you for that.

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 08:30 PM
Last but not least :)

I quote from http://www.kamakoti.org/miscl/divine50b.html
Our religion Hinduism has grown by devotion, meditation and self - purification.

reks
02-27-2004, 10:54 PM
Not true scientifically. Wearing metal (gold or pithallai.. !!) is not beneficial healthwise, its only ornamental...
No medically proven use. Not a bit.


hehe Vasan, finally was able to find some medical proof for the benefits of wearing Copper!!... thou was not able to find any for gold, silver or pithallai in the net.. Nyways this is wat i found...

Probably the most authoritative publication on the subject is Dr. Helmar Dollwet's book, "The Copper Bracelet and Arthritis", 1981 Vantage Press. In it Dr. Dollwet explains that copper is an essential element of an enzyme necessary for the production and regeneration of the cartilage lining the bone surfaces. Copper (and zinc) he explains, are also essential to Super-oxide Dismutase (SOD) which cleans up superoxide radicals that can be destructive to human body tissues.

Also read in some site, that Silver being a good conductor can absorb polar energies from the earth and passes it to the body, which refreshes the whole body system - thou i dont think this is a medically proven fact...

I dont think, antha kalathula follow panna entha traditionum was without any proper base... even most of which we consider as mooda nambikais today do have authentic reasons behind it... (i agree some are reallllly mooda nambikai)... thou ofcourse, theres nothing wrong if we choose not to follow them...

and no i wasnt talking abt boosting self confidence etc... i dont think a peice of metal can boost your self-confidence :D

gokulan42
02-27-2004, 11:43 PM
hehe Vasan, finally was able to find some medical proof for the benefits of wearing Copper!!... thou was not able to find any for gold, silver or pithallai in the net.. Nyways this is wat i found...

Probably the most authoritative publication on the subject is Dr. Helmar Dollwet's book, "The Copper Bracelet and Arthritis", 1981 Vantage Press. In it Dr. Dollwet explains that copper is an essential element of an enzyme necessary for the production and regeneration of the cartilage lining the bone surfaces. Copper (and zinc) he explains, are also essential to Super-oxide Dismutase (SOD) which cleans up superoxide radicals that can be destructive to human body tissues.

Also read in some site, that Silver being a good conductor can absorb polar energies from the earth and passes it to the body, which refreshes the whole body system - thou i dont think this is a medically proven fact...

I dont think, antha kalathula follow panna entha traditionum was without any proper base... even most of which we consider as mooda nambikais today do have authentic reasons behind it... (i agree some are reallllly mooda nambikai)... thou ofcourse, theres nothing wrong if we choose not to follow them...

and no i wasnt talking abt boosting self confidence etc... i dont think a peice of metal can boost your self-confidence :D

Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help.

Please, explain :)

dinesh
02-28-2004, 12:17 AM
Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help.

Classic :b:
I like your arguments sishya :)

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 12:31 AM
Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help.

Classic :b:
I like your arguments sishya :)

Your blessings, gurudev :)

butterfly
02-28-2004, 12:35 AM
I appreciate all your opinions and these are your opinions and the above said are mine, our opinions do not change some one's belief. So if some women feels that Thaali is very important to her please do not argue on that fact. Its their belief and they might get hurt about it. Respect it and then youwill realize the power it has. Its not a mere ornament as per me.

I will not join any more debate on this topic. I have put forth my opinion and my opinion is what i believe.

Cheers,


Venky,
Pls dont take it personal...I think everyone is talking about their feelings on thaali...& U know we all appreciate ur input...

Everyone else,
Its nice to see various ideas....can we just concentrate on Thaali for now...we will open another topic for metti :)

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 12:38 AM
இதெல்லாம் மனது சம்பந்தப்ப ட்ட விடயம்.. சொன்னால் புரியாது :sm05:

Please, try with me :)

I ask the judge to close the debate in favour of 'thali is not mandatory' :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

sagi
02-28-2004, 01:03 AM
heheh athu thaan sonna puriyathu ennu sonnena gokulan ;) :D

reks
02-28-2004, 01:08 AM
:evil: :evil: :evil: to Guru and Shishya



Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help.


ogi.. copper bracelets anybody can wear anytime... there are no restrictions towards it.

Metti, if as being claimed, revitalizes the reproductive organs and helps women conceive, then it only makes sense that unmarried women or widows shouldnt wear them.. that too in a culture like ours. :D

Now regarding thaali, I said, "its not a sin, if you choose not to wear your thaali daily". And ofcourse, as I dont understand the significance of removing the thaali after ones husbands death, am not supporting it either.

Nyways as Thaali signifies the marriage, the bond, ofcourse you cant wear it from the day you are born until the day you die :00: ... but u can alwez wear some other gold ornament if you are concerned about the benefits of gold... nobody is against it.

:yes: oh yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa (kaduvulae nee thaan enna kapathanum :pray: )

reks
02-28-2004, 01:10 AM
ok pattams.. no more talk about metti... :sm08:

reks
02-28-2004, 01:28 AM
Venky, Your posts are very informative and good... I never knew the meaning of the mantra etc... learned some new things from your posts.

we are arguing just for the sake of a debate, a healthy debate :)... Expecting more contributions from your side :sm08:

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 01:38 AM
:evil: :evil: :evil: to Guru and Shishya

Now regarding thaali, I said, "its not a sin, if you choose not to wear your thaali daily". And ofcourse, as I dont understand the significance of removing the thaali after ones husbands death, am not supporting it either.

Nyways as Thaali signifies the marriage, the bond, ofcourse you cant wear it from the day you are born until the day you die :00: ... but u can alwez wear some other gold ornament if you are concerned about the benefits of gold... nobody is against it.

:yes: oh yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa (kaduvulae nee thaan enna kapathanum :pray: )

Reks, lets not upset pattams by discussing other nonthali ornaments, ok :)

See, I disagree. If thali is for medical grounds, my above questions still stand. I repeat 'Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help?'

If its mandatory for religious reasons, go back and read my posts. However, I would like to give a link from a 'popular' religious site. I quote from http://www.kamakoti.org/miscl/divine50b.html
Our religion Hinduism has grown by devotion, meditation and self - purification.

If you are in my team, please say 'thali is not mandatory' and let the judge conclude this debate accordingly :)

Appuram tell anything about me. Namma thalaiya pathi edhavathu sonna, naan manusana irukke matten ;)

reks
02-28-2004, 03:48 AM
I repeat 'Oh yaah. So, if somebody's hubby is dead, they do not need this medical help, huh. How is that? If it is medically beneficial, why cant you wear it all the time (the day you are born and until the day you are dead). And, what about the guys. Only, married ladies need this medical help?'


and I too repeat: "Nyways as Thaali signifies the marriage, the bond, ofcourse you cant wear it from the day you are born until the day you die ... but u can alwez wear some other gold ornament if you are concerned about the benefits of gold... nobody is against it. " :D

And, I didnt say wearing a thaali is good for your blood circulation... i only said, wearing Gold is good..


ogi.. nyways, தாலி கட்டி கல்யாணம் கட்டுனா, அதுக்கு குடுக்க வேண்டிய மரியாதை குடுத்து தான் ஆகனும். You shouldnt simply consider it as a mere identification tag... But me wont accept that daily athu kaluthula potta thaan mariyathai. As long as you understand its significance, its fine. If you dont value it, register office poi kalyanam katikalamae...

So I dont think its mandatory that you have to wear your thaali daily
(But if this means, joining you and ur gurus team, am seriously thinking of கட்சி தாவுதல் :think: )

sagi
02-28-2004, 03:57 AM
kalyaanan thaan katti kittu odi polaama? - illai
odi poiyi kalyanam thaan kattikkalama?

So what i am about to say is that....even odi poravanga gives importance to thaali ;)

reks
02-28-2004, 04:14 AM
:sm12: ha ha sagi

தாலிய தான் கட்டிகிட்ட ு பெத்துகலாம ா
இல்ல புள்ள குட்டி பெத்து கிட்டு கட்டிகலாமா

kalyanam minadi kozhantha pethukravanga kuda thaali'ku importance kudukranga :wink:

good interpretation sagi :)

vasan
02-28-2004, 04:19 AM
thaali'ku importance kudukranga


no importance.. thats why you could do it now, or later or as implied never.. how is my parallel thinking... :lol:

sagi
02-28-2004, 04:34 AM
but you HAVE to do it either noe or later...so important thaan ;)

reks
02-28-2004, 04:36 AM
no importance.. thats why you could do it now, or later or as implied never.. how is my parallel thinking...
:sm12:

:evil: kasta pattu oru dubakoor song'ku nalla meaning kandu pidichi debate win panalam patha vida mateengalae :lol:

sagi
02-28-2004, 05:01 AM
porukkathu ivangalukk u ..illa reks? ;)

vasan
02-28-2004, 05:26 AM
பொறுத்தார் பூமி ஆழ்வார்ன்ன ு சொல்லுவாங் க.. :ahha:

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 05:31 AM
So I dont think its mandatory that you have to wear your thaali daily
(But if this means, joining you and ur gurus team, am seriously thinking of கட்சி தாவுதல் :think: )

Ithu okkenga :) As I told you earliar in one other thread, I like you :)

We will welcome you with a big hug *no bad intentions* . We cannot afford to lose you. Its because of you that we are winning. Okya :) :sm30: :sm30:

sagi
02-28-2004, 06:01 AM
கரும்புக் கட்டோடு இருந்தா, எறும்பு தானே வரும் ;)

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 07:37 AM
கரும்புக் கட்டோடு இருந்தா, எறும்பு தானே வரும் ;)

Aiyayoo! puriyalai Sagi

Shy
02-28-2004, 05:07 PM
Late someback !!!

Venky :clap: :clap: :clap:

Very good points and explanation :b:

My thoughts

Every Indian woman consider thaali as the most prestigious token of love offered to her by her husband during the ceremony. What does that mean, venky has already explained perfectly.

First think about Indian in this world. A rich country with all cultures and traditions, where other country can even come near. Even though it has some bad stuff in it, most of them are very important for a man to lead a disciplined life. Just yaenoo thaanoonu ellama, oru naeri muraiyaa valrathula enna thappu??? Oru Indian ponna irunthutu she cant just insult to think thaali as an ornament. Its just shes insulting the entire heritage. Ennaga paeriyaa belief !!!! Epadi solli sooli thaan India is more and more becoming like other counties.. oru tradition, culture sense yaethuvum ellai.. chumma daily minikitu pooga thaan everyone loves..These peopel who say that they have theri own belief, I arent smart or lucky enough to be an Indian and know abt all these rich culture they have.

Westernai paarthu.. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: u dont have any tradition and culture.. u are a messed up countrynu we laugh.. But I dont know why such people dont respect the tradition and culture their country has. YES.. Thaali poodanum every women, she shouldnt part away from it. Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku.. Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom. Appadi think paaanam, i have my own beliefnu solitu poona... then in 100 years u can see India called as Little america. So people, before trying to say anything, just sit back and think what our owns. Be proud of it and try to abide by the rich culture it gives us. If u respect ur country then it means u also respecting what our ancestors had left us, the really valuable ones !!!! :b:

As a Indian citizen you should be able to pass their culture as generations pass by.. thats ur duty for this country who gave u such culture and tradition.... Innaiku naan pistu, i have my own belief, why shud i wear a thaaalinu neenga athai ornamnetnu sutheetu irukalaam.. athai paakura unga kids..ohh thaaliyaa.. yeah dude, shes wears at times .. i dont know what the big deal abt that!!! appadinu solitu poogum... do u think that kid's children will know anything abt Thaalli???

Money saethu vachutu pooneegaloo ellaiyoo, try to follow our tradition and pass them along.. Thats the best thing u can do to ur family and this society.. If u follow this , your life by itself will be more plesant. Ur will be more streamlined in your life, oru kattupaadu, sincerity, honesty ellam irukkum!!!



Shy

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 05:57 PM
A very good and a sure compelling response. But, here is what I would say....


Every Indian woman consider thaali as the most prestigious token of love offered to her by her husband during the ceremony.
Not all the times. Lots of times, its just a part of the fun (marriage). How many guys do you think even know about the details of the thali (design, weight, ...), which is supposed to be (in your words) 'the most prestigious token of love'. Very few :) I am practical.


[b]Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku..
So, its only applicable to the ladies. Married guys are ok and they can do 'thappu' with unmarried gals. Isn't it? Is that a reason we should keep it ;)


before trying to say anything, just sit back and think what our owns. Be proud of it and try to abide by the rich culture it gives us. If u respect ur country then it means u also respecting what our ancestors had left us, the really valuable ones
Shy, we are all very proud of our culture for 'all the real valuable ones'. No doubt about it. I called so many times in this forum to defend our culture against any western culture in this world. That dint change a bit. But, as i quoted from kanchi matam, Hinduism is grown by self-purification and it is not wrong to purify some unwarranted stuff. Our culture will only grow from it and wont diminish.

And also, we should restrain BS'ing other cultures for no reason. I dont laugh at western cultures at all. They have very good ones too. They are not as old as ours but still have som.


As a Indian citizen you should be able to pass their culture as generations pass by.. thats ur duty for this country who gave u such culture and tradition....

Thats exactly my point, in a different tone ofcourse :ee:

As an Indian citizen, it is our responsibility to purify ourselves if a small par to of our culture is not applicable. Take sati, widows poor plights, mandatory use of thali for ladies only, ban of first cousing marriages (its scientifically proven un healthy) and other stuff which are no longer applicable/reasonable now. That gives a very good (and still very very rich) culture for our future generations to follow and ofcourse if requied purify. If there was no changes from the original culture, we would be this rich culturally. As Sri's signature says. Change is constant and should be.

And btw, I do not want to quote my own posts. Can you please read them and reply to some of my very valid questions?

dinesh
02-28-2004, 06:48 PM
Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku.. Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom.
Each and every married person should have this feeling even if they are not wearing the thaali. If one needs a thaali to remind this to her, then obviously there is some problem with her. As for identification, that's what I've been telling from the beginning.

Sishya, I agree with your comments wholeheartedly :clap:
I'm proud to have such a sishyan ;)

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 07:06 PM
Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku.. Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom.
Each and every married person should have this feeling even if they are not wearing the thaali. If one needs a thaali to remind this to her, then obviously there is some problem with her. As for identification, that's what I've been telling from the beginning.
Appadi podunga, thala. thalana thalai than :)



Sishya, I agree with your comments wholeheartedly :clap:
I'm proud to have such a sishyan ;)

Ellam unga aseervatham ;)

Shy
02-28-2004, 07:25 PM
Not all the times. Lots of times, its just a part of the fun (marriage). How many guys do you think even know about the details of the thali (design, weight, ...), which is supposed to be (in your words) 'the most prestigious token of love'. Very few :) I am practical.

Theriyaama irukarthu avanga avanga mistake.. Enakku theriyathu enakku theriyaathu yaen irukeenga.. Thalli kata theriyuthu..thaali vaangika theriyuthu.. yaen katroom.. yaethuku'nu think panni irukeengala ennaikaavathu.. just to get married thaan most important thought.. appadi oru ponnu kadaicha, ennai nambinu thaan u guys think... oru computer vaangarathukku evalavu research panreenga.. when for some materialistic thing u take just time.. just that one day whats the meaning of all these'nu think panalaamla... thats too.. u are the one performing all those.. athai vitutu, eppada gifts open panalaam.. honeymoon poolaamnu unga "PRACTICAL" thought mass ur mind.. then its ur fault. !!!!! Just dont say practical, practical for everything we do.. If all in our hands... one day.. sincere'a yaethuku ennanu think panni understand panikarthula enna paeriyaa practical thoughts is lost else ??????


So, its only applicable to the ladies. Married guys are ok and they can do 'thappu' with unmarried gals. Isn't it? Is that a reason we should keep it ;)

Before writing, think why I wrote that. Girls appadi thappu pannina shes the one whose goign to suffer a lot and because of that the entire family!!!! Thappu pannitu.. if shes pregnant.. yaar thalai kuniyarathu.. ava matum ellai.. that unborn child, the family, the entire society...But a guy... sollunga.. if he cheats.. whose at loss there.. avanukku thaan arivu ellai.. thappu panraan..manasaachiyae ellama.. but does he loses in anythign in life, apart from all he had lost already, respect, sincerity, honesty etc ...


Shy, we are all very proud of our culture for 'all the real valuable ones'. No doubt about it.

yeah Right :lol: :lol: ...


I called so many times in this forum to defend our culture against any western culture in this world. That dint change a bit. But, as i quoted from kanchi matam, Hinduism is grown by self-purification and it is not wrong to purify some unwarranted stuff. Our culture will only grow from it and wont diminish.

First tell me what is unwarranted stuff??? Oru culture will grow only if we follow those.. Ellaina, as there is a census that Tamil will die in 50 years, so does all our cultures !!!!
BTW culture'a u dont belief, appuram how will it grow..


And also, we should restrain BS'ing other cultures for no reason. I dont laugh at western cultures at all. They have very good ones too. They are not as old as ours but still have som.

First no one is BSing their culture.. I dont see if they have any, thats all..BTW what type of culture these amercians have,a part from ripping of the land from the native Indians???? Italians have theri own, spanish theirs, and so does all the immigrants.. But as americans, apart from christmas, thanksgiving is there anything they can say that its their culture or tradition.. tell me one thats worth comparing with ours..


Thats exactly my point, in a different tone ofcourse :ee:

Aamaa.. can u explain me how???


As an Indian citizen, it is our responsibility to purify ourselves if a small par to of our culture is not applicable. Take sati, widows poor plights, mandatory use of thali for ladies only, ban of first cousing marriages (its scientifically proven un healthy) and other stuff which are no longer applicable/reasonable now.

I didnt say everything our culture has for us is to be followed and its good... Also sati ellam was twisted by some selfish gooses in between.. There is nowhere in the history that a woman to go along with her dead husband.. So culture/traditoion theriyaama ellathaiyum kutham sola kuudaathu :nono: :nono: ....

Answer me if the our tradition/culture is worth following or not.. Except for a very few things that too which are twisted in these recent 100 years... let me whats wrong in any of them???? Why is that a country with all these cultures/traditions still dying has less number of personal problems when compared to any part of the world???

Shy

Shy
02-28-2004, 07:30 PM
Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku.. Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom.

Each and every married person should have this feeling even if they are not wearing the thaali. If one needs a thaali to remind this to her, then obviously there is some problem with her. As for identification, that's what I've been telling from the beginning.

No u dont understand it.. Thats all I can say....

When shes urged to do that because of whatever the reason may be.. that shes out of mind.. atleast seeing something might remind her of whats shes abt to do...I cant explain futher.. U have to just sit and think the situation she might be in when shes going to fall in the pit.. I dont remeber the flim name, where some heroine will be there married to some guy and he cant make her happy.. she will slip for a minute to bhakiraj.. then come back to senses... I dont want to explain this any futher.. I guess women who reading this will understand more better !!!

Shy

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 07:54 PM
http://www.kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part21/chap6.htm

In the old days they used to wear what is called an arikandam, that is an iron ring, round the neck to keep themselves disciplined and live according to the sastras. In the same way we must wear an arikandam to keep the mind from going astray. To be involved in good actions is itself a kind of arikandam.

IMO, In some oppurtunistic times, some male chauvanistic power changed that to a thali for ladies only.

Also, did you hear about 'gandharva', also an acceptable hindu style marriage. There is no 'thali' there. WHY?

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 08:01 PM
When shes urged to do that because of whatever the reason may be.. that shes out of mind.. atleast seeing something might remind her of whats shes abt to do...I cant explain futher.. U have to just sit and think the situation she might be in when shes going to fall in the pit.. I dont remeber the flim name, where some heroine will be there married to some guy and he cant make her happy.. she will slip for a minute to bhakiraj.. then come back to senses... I dont want to explain this any futher.. I guess women who reading this will understand more better !!!

Shy
So, thali saves her eventhough she decides to slip? Good logic. What happens to the same woman when she goes to a place where she has to remove the thali? I will save my guys comparision for another post. But, why does not it apply to unmarried females. We can still have some thali kinda thing to remind a woman not to slip, right. It helps. So, why not we?

gokulan42
02-28-2004, 08:27 PM
Not all the times. Lots of times, its just a part of the fun (marriage). How many guys do you think even know about the details of the thali (design, weight, ...), which is supposed to be (in your words) 'the most prestigious token of love'. Very few :) I am practical.

Theriyaama irukarthu avanga avanga mistake.. Enakku theriyathu enakku theriyaathu yaen irukeenga.. Thalli kata theriyuthu..thaali vaangika theriyuthu.. yaen katroom.. yaethuku'nu think panni irukeengala ennaikaavathu.. just to get married thaan most important thought.. appadi oru ponnu kadaicha, ennai nambinu thaan u guys think... oru computer vaangarathukku evalavu research panreenga.. when for some materialistic thing u take just time.. just that one day whats the meaning of all these'nu think panalaamla... thats too.. u are the one performing all those.. athai vitutu, eppada gifts open panalaam.. honeymoon poolaamnu unga "PRACTICAL" thought mass ur mind.. then its ur fault. !!!!! Just dont say practical, practical for everything we do.. If all in our hands... one day.. sincere'a yaethuku ennanu think panni understand panikarthula enna paeriyaa practical thoughts is lost else ??????

Cool down, Shy. Your 'ever single women considers thali as the most pres. token of love itself' is wrong. Ask around ladies. Lets say how many say they considered as a 'most pres' toekn of love' and how many think that they have to wear this as an identity of married. Before blaming the guys for not knowing the details of thali, you should blame the ladies (in your words, each and every one of them) for blindly assuming that it is selected by the guy as his most prestigious token of love ;)

When I said practical, I dint mean all these things :)

However, how many ladies know the details about the most prestigious toen of love from them, the 'metti' to the guy. I am not going to say that they are thinking about honeymoon instead ;)



So, its only applicable to the ladies. Married guys are ok and they can do 'thappu' with unmarried gals. Isn't it? Is that a reason we should keep it ;)

Before writing, think why I wrote that. Girls appadi thappu pannina shes the one whose goign to suffer a lot and because of that the entire family!!!! Thappu pannitu.. if shes pregnant.. yaar thalai kuniyarathu.. ava matum ellai.. that unborn child, the family, the entire society...But a guy... sollunga.. if he cheats.. whose at loss there.. avanukku thaan arivu ellai.. thappu panraan..manasaachiyae ellama.. but does he loses in anythign in life, apart from all he had lost already, respect, sincerity, honesty etc ...
Please!!!! Now, there are so many ways not to be pregnant and all. So, your whole reasoning is gone astray. And even then, why does not it apply to the unmarried ladies. And, guys are as moral as ladies are. This guys are from mars and ladies are from venus is not acceptable (Atleast not to me). To commit a sin(in marriage), a guy needs a ladies partner, right? And, if a guy slips, he is to regret the whole thing too. I guess this is altogether a different topic to discuss. LEts open a new thread for this.



Shy, we are all very proud of our culture for 'all the real valuable ones'. No doubt about it.

yeah Right :lol: :lol: ...
I was not kidding there.



I called so many times in this forum to defend our culture against any western culture in this world. That dint change a bit. But, as i quoted from kanchi matam, Hinduism is grown by self-purification and it is not wrong to purify some unwarranted stuff. Our culture will only grow from it and wont diminish.

First tell me what is unwarranted stuff??? Oru culture will grow only if we follow those.. Ellaina, as there is a census that Tamil will die in 50 years, so does all our cultures !!!!
BTW culture'a u dont belief, appuram how will it grow..
Yes, it will die if we dont take corrective measures. Thats the reason for debates like this. I wanted to call these stupid but instead calling them unwarranted to avoid hurting others. As per vedas, chanting of mantras is enough for marriage and thali is NOT required. Did you happen to see my post (2 above, I think).



And also, we should restrain BS'ing other cultures for no reason. I dont laugh at western cultures at all. They have very good ones too. They are not as old as ours but still have som.

First no one is BSing their culture.. I dont see if they have any, thats all..tell me one thats worth comparing with ours..
No child marriage, No marriage between cousins (first or second), No polygamy. No thali kind of identity that is meant ONLY for females, no white sarees for widows and they are allowed in all kinds of rituals,



As an Indian citizen, it is our responsibility to purify ourselves if a small par to of our culture is not applicable. Take sati, widows poor plights, mandatory use of thali for ladies only, ban of first cousing marriages (its scientifically proven un healthy) and other stuff which are no longer applicable/reasonable now.

I didnt say everything our culture has for us is to be followed and its good... Also sati ellam was twisted by some selfish gooses in between.. There is nowhere in the history that a woman to go along with her dead husband.. So culture/traditoion theriyaama ellathaiyum kutham sola kuudaathu :nono: :nono: ....
Shy, I read and try to learn constantly. I am not ignorant. I gave enough evidence to support my claim and to show what I read and how much I know. I never said sati was found at the same time when the culture/religion was born. Same is thali. As per vedas, chanting of mantra is enough for a marriage. Then why do we need thali? What do you think about gandharva (love marriage)?


Answer me if the our tradition/culture is worth following or not.. Except for a very few things that too which are twisted in these recent 100 years... let me whats wrong in any of them???? Why is that a country with all these cultures/traditions still dying has less number of personal problems when compared to any part of the world???

Shy
I dint say our culture as a whole is bad. I am ONLY discussing about the mandatory requirement of thali wearing. Our tradition is worth following if we get rid of some of the negative and 'unwarranted' stuff. If we dont cure ourselves with the present circumstances, then as you told there is a possibility that our culture can be left behind.

reks
02-28-2004, 09:34 PM
"thaali as the most prestigious token of love " - I definetly agree with you Shy :clap:




Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku.. Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom. Appadi think paaanam, i have my own beliefnu solitu poona... then in 100 years u can see India called as Little america


hey Shy, i dont agree with this...தாலி பார்த்தா தான் ஒரு பொண்ணுக்கு தன்க்கு கல்யாண்ம் அயிடிச்சி தப்பு பண்ண கூடாது, நினைப்பு வரும்'னா.... ரொம்ப கஷ்டம்.... ரொம்ப நாள் தாக்கு பிடிக்க மாட்டா :snooty:

and தாலி remind பண்ணா தான் தப்பு பண்ணாம இருப்பாங்க 'னா நாளைக்கு இவுங்கள மனுஷ்ன்'னு remind பண்ண கூட எதாவது தேவை படும்.



she will slip for a minute to bhakiraj.. then come back to senses...

cinema'la neraiya intha mathri stunt kattuvanga... :D

Nyways, taking it seriously, its just a symbolic way of showing what is going on in her mind. just a technique used. So ultimately her thoughts and her values are what that refrain her from doing wrong.


yeah dude, shes wears at times .. i dont know what the big deal abt that!!!

even if you wear a 10, 20 poun( i dont know the english for poun.. or is it poun only :( ) thaali all the time and if you dont have proper values or if you dont instill those values in your kids, still they are going to say this..

Thaali is very precious, no doubt, but its not going to help enhance ones character or values, neither going to increase the respect a lady gains in the society. Its her acts , her character what fetches her respect.

vasan
02-28-2004, 09:49 PM
"thaali as the most prestigious token of love " - I definetly agree with you Shy :clap:


Absolutely. But if it is only a token of love, its between two people. What if Aishwarya ( :sm11: ) thinks Vasan's poems ( :Ksp: ) are the most important token his love for her? :wink: Why on earth should the society (and any body) insist on thaali?

Between me and a girl, what we choose is prestigious or precious or most important is our choice. And for each person the same way too. May be I would not care if she wears thaali 24/7 but it would be nice to know that she cherishes something -- even a distant memory. Why objectifying love to make it precious or prestigious? It is great all by itself.. Thaali is not necessary.

Vasan

ps: Does geetham etiquette permit people to use their 'crushes' names in serious posts?? If not then may be I will change the name to chewbucca.. :)

ps-ukku-oru-ps: Ho.. if its such a prestigious TOKEN of love, don't you think guys also should get a thaali? as a token of a girls love.. ?? :oops: :oops: Doi.. intha maathiri lateral thinking is not good for my health.. Appuram everybody will have a 'moral safety collar' 'love token thread', 'i am taken post its' and 'i-am-a-married-but-available :wink: rings'... Sorry for the light hearted remarks folks. But just to let you know how objectifying only one ORNAMENT to represent all these things would lead us to. On the other hand, if its religious reasons and you gotta do it, of course, its your freedom as a practitioner of that faith (rings, thaali, or any other equivalent things) !!

anainar
02-29-2004, 12:25 AM
Vasan,

Light hearted remarks are the need of the hour for this discussion that is going in pages of heated debate ,"Them vs Us". Gokul, you the man! Great arguments.

First and formost, I want to bring a little bit legal perspective here. Because I believe in confusing people. :lol: As per Hindu Marriages Act, tieing of Thaali not a pre requisite. The law is very clear that taking of seven steps in front of sacred fire is a ceremony in Hindu marriages but not Thaali. And our fathers of Constitution are not dumbos. It was written by our own great lauret Dr.Ambedkar. The reason for leaving thaali would have been because some sects of Hindus did not make thaali mandatory. But taking seven steps in front of fire is common. "Agni saatchiyaaga" is the phrase that is used to solemnize a marriage. That makes the argument that Thaali is necessary or it came from history of neck cuffs as nonsense.

Shy, having a thaali to remind oneself that she is married is totally untenable. I lived in the US for one year waiting for my wife to deliver the baby and join me. I did not need any reminder that I am married. And so was she. So, that is an argument that cannot hold water at all.

I can take it as a token of love, which will make my wife to think about me one more time than she does normally. Because it has sharp corners. :lol: But I dont attach any value beyond that. My mom and sisters were totally different though. May be it is a girl's thing that we guys dont understand.

Cheers

RaasuKutty
02-29-2004, 12:38 AM
All these practices originated long time back.. Our forefathers kept morales and rules that would suit them the best during THEIR PERIOD and lot of practices that our predecessors were following had either scientific or moral reasons.. and some had social reasons...

The social and moral practices need to keep changing accordingly as the clock ticks... we cannot expect this to be same for 10 generations.... enakkum enga appa kkum irukkara generation gap aa rommmmmmbaa perisu nnu naan nenaikkaren.... idhula 1500's 900 BC la sonna social and moral rules 2000 AD la work aagumaa....
ex.) hospital aa thali remove pannuvaangaa... during our ancestors period.. no hospital or something like that.. so when they framed a moral rule.. they made it in such a way that women shud never remove thali... but we are much much different from what ppl were 10 generations back.....

kaalathin kattayam... ellam change aaganum...

CHANGE IS THE ONLY CONSTANT THING.....

vasan
02-29-2004, 01:20 AM
All these practices originated long time back.. Our forefathers kept morales and rules that would suit them the best during THEIR PERIOD and lot of practices that our predecessors were following had either scientific or moral reasons.. and some had social reasons...

It is also more than possible that people had no or totally stupid reasons. Just like today. Not everything has to have a reason. Not every one is always, in every aspect reasonable and logical. And not every practice is really have to have a good and sound logical reasoning behind it. Even the elders can make (and probably did make) many a mistakes.

Progression of human life and thought and civilization depends on both unreasonable choices we make, as well consious, thoughtful reasons made to the best of societies abilities for the given times.

Though this is more anthropological philosopy (more confusing, to add to Anainaar's Legal dealings :lol:) this also applies, as for as I am concerned, to the issue at hand - or at neck, since its thaali !!!

RaasuKutty
02-29-2004, 02:51 AM
It is also more than possible that people had no or totally stupid reasons

I differ from u in this regard... I dont claim that our ancesstors made only the best decisions.... At the same time.. a stupid practice cannot have crossed so many generations...
ex.. ppl might have read practices where in ppl used to bury children claiming X reason... These kind of practices will die down... probably in the same generation.. Such a practice will not continue for 100's or 1000's of years....
The practices that we r discussing in this thread have been followed for 100's of years.. (this might date back even to 1000's)... So I wudn't accept these practices that have come for stupid reasons..... there wud definitively be proper reasoning....

Honeyarjun
02-29-2004, 03:08 AM
I was very much hesitating in my mind whether I should continue this heated debate...but am replying only for a healthy debate... I am sorry for my outrageous reply...but shy's post has offended me a bit.. so here I go with my response...


Every Indian woman consider thaali as the most prestigious token of love offered to her by her husband during the ceremony.

C'mon ...pls dont generalize and order(or advice) people here to follow something.. If its your opinion..you can keep it to urself.. but pls remember others have differing opinions.. and what is the husband wearing for the token of love... why is it that only women should wear this token of love???


First think about Indian in this world. A rich country with all cultures and traditions, where other country can even come near. Even though it has some bad stuff in it, most of them are very important for a man to lead a disciplined life.

No one is saying here that India is a country without culture.. We all agree and have the same opinion that India is great in its culture and traditions.. but do we need to have this preaching here????


Just yaenoo thaanoonu ellama, oru naeri muraiyaa valrathula enna thappu???

Only if we wear thali..ponnu olunga vaalvalla enna???

Oru Indian ponna irunthutu she cant just insult to think thaali as an ornament. Its just shes insulting the entire heritage. Ennaga paeriyaa belief !!!! Epadi solli sooli thaan India is more and more becoming like other counties.. oru tradition, culture sense yaethuvum ellai.. chumma daily minikitu pooga thaan everyone loves..These peopel who say that they have theri own belief, I arent smart or lucky enough to be an Indian and know abt all these rich culture they have.

I am really sorry..I beg to differ from all the above.... Just because one says thali is an ornament , it doesnt mean that they are bad and follow wrong culture.. NO one here is so ignorant to our culture.. and we all respect it.. so pls reconsider your decision to call us unlucky to be Indians.. I am prould to be an Indian and respect my country..Just because I say thali is an ornament it doesnt mean that I am not fit to be an Indian...


Thaali poodanum every women, she shouldnt part away from it. Each time thappu pana nenaikum poothum, oru entire family ir behind hernu thoonanum avalukku..

What ???? Thali prevents a woman from making mistakes.... The second she thinks some other person in her mind...the same minute she betrays her husband.. Relationship and betrayal are not only physical things..but mainly mental stuff..and If thali is the only thing thats going to save her.... c'mon its a just a matter of time.. God save the woman...


Every guy seeing that shes wearing a thaali should respect her as his mom. Appadi think paaanam, i have my own beliefnu solitu poona... then in 100 years u can see India called as Little america. So people, before trying to say anything, just sit back and think what our owns. Be proud of it and try to abide by the rich culture it gives us. If u respect ur country then it means u also respecting what our ancestors had left us, the really valuable ones !!!!

As a Indian citizen you should be able to pass their culture as generations pass by.. thats ur duty for this country who gave u such culture and tradition.... Innaiku naan pistu, i have my own belief, why shud i wear a thaaalinu neenga athai ornamnetnu sutheetu irukalaam.. athai paakura unga kids..ohh thaaliyaa.. yeah dude, shes wears at times .. i dont know what the big deal abt that!!! appadinu solitu poogum... do u think that kid's children will know anything abt Thaalli???Money saethu vachutu pooneegaloo ellaiyoo, try to follow our tradition and pass them along.. Thats the best thing u can do to ur family and this society.. If u follow this , your life by itself will be more plesant. Ur will be more streamlined in your life, oru kattupaadu, sincerity, honesty ellam irukkum!!!




I completely agree with you in this point alone..we need to teach and let our kids know abt Indian culture ..Following them is their own wish...But I will never force them to follow something they dont believe in..

Finally ... Are the woman of India still wear sarees without blouses as that was the culture followed in early times..are the indians still walk and use horses for travel as that used to be the way long back?? Are we still walking with bare foot?? Are we still eating here in US in restaurants using hands as it is what followed in India?? I can give numerous examples.... am saying this why b'coz.... we change to situations... we try to live a practical life and we neednt have to close our eyes blindly and say ...our ancestors said this so me going to follow it blindly... Its like locking ourselves in a box and throwing away the key...

One last question for you shy... can u pls answer my question in my previous post..(will you say the same dialogues to the doc when u go to an operation theatre????)

gokulan42
02-29-2004, 03:10 AM
It is also more than possible that people had no or totally stupid reasons

I differ from u in this regard... I dont claim that our ancesstors made only the best decisions.... At the same time.. a stupid practice cannot have crossed so many generations...
ex.. ppl might have read practices where in ppl used to bury children claiming X reason... These kind of practices will die down... probably in the same generation.. Such a practice will not continue for 100's or 1000's of years....
The practices that we r discussing in this thread have been followed for 100's of years.. (this might date back even to 1000's)... So I wudn't accept these practices that have come for stupid reasons..... there wud definitively be proper reasoning....

I would love to debate with you for some of the reasons' stupidity. But, I restrain from that for the sake of winning this debate. Guys, since its kinda closed towards 'thali is not mandatory'. I request the honourable judge to declare thus and allow us to concentrate on another interesting topic 'Metti' :)

Very good debate from both sides. Thala (shidinesh), Guru (anainar), Vasan, Reks posted some excellent posts to support my team :)

Hats of to Venky & Shy. WOW! You guys are simply great. Way to go......

anainar
02-29-2004, 03:23 AM
Guku,

The jury is out there still. The starter of the thread is Pattaams who has to come, summarise and tell us, "Guys you dont know what is Thaali" or "Guys, yes, you do know some thing about Thaali".

But as far as any Judge sitting even in a thukkada court in the far corners of Munireddypalayam in India, thaali is not mandatory. I rest my case. If any one has any doubts about my statements, please read the Hindu Marriages Act, 1955, Section 7.

Cheers

gokulan42
02-29-2004, 03:36 AM
Guku,

The jury is out there still. The starter of the thread is Pattaams who has to come, summarise and tell us, "Guys you dont know what is Thaali" or "Guys, yes, you do know some thing about Thaali".

But as far as any Judge sitting even in a thukkada court in the far corners of Munireddypalayam in India, thaali is not mandatory. I rest my case. If any one has any doubts about my statements, please read the Hindu Marriages Act, 1955, Section 7.

Cheers

Guru, I completly agree with you. Our team is strong. We covered pretty much everything be it legal, supernatural, cultural, medical, social and what not. Lets see what Pattams has to say now.

reks
02-29-2004, 12:27 PM
What if Aishwarya ( ) thinks Vasan's poems ( ) are the most important token his love for her?

:00: :00: :00: :doh: :doh: :doh: :sm12:



ps-ukku-oru-ps: Doi.. intha maathiri lateral thinking is not good for my health.. Appuram everybody will have a 'moral safety collar' 'love token thread', 'i am taken post its' and 'i-am-a-married-but-available rings'... Sorry for the light hearted remarks folks.
Yeah absolutely... lateral thinking is very bad for your health... that too while reading my posts :ee:

imagine ppl walking around with "i am taken post its" and " i am a married but available ring"... :lol: :lol: :lol:

now coming to the point: arghhhhhhhhh avlo line type panirken.. intha oru line' thaan kannuku theriyanuma :evil:
nyways.. my point is "if u chose to wed by tying a thaali, the thaali should be given its due respect and not treated like other ornaments. ".. But am not supporting that thaali is mandatory or it fetches you any spl respect etc...

butterfly
02-29-2004, 06:01 PM
achechoooo.....enn questionai debate topica maathi...ippadi team form panni...ivalavu azhaga vaathaditeengo....so mudivu than enna??
I think I am still standing where I started :(....Is it imp for women to wear it all the time??



Saptapadi

The bride and groom take seven steps together, symbolizing the beginning of their journey through life as partners. These seven steps reflect their guiding principles in life. As they take each step, the bride and groom exchange the following vows:

Together we will:

Share in the responsibility of the home

Fill our hearts with strength and courage

Prosper and share our worldly goods

Fill our hearts with love, peace, happiness, and spiritual values

Be blessed with loving children

Attain self-restraint and longevity

Be best friends and eternal partners


I think this makes more sense

again...if thaali had so much meaning I think it shud be worn even after her hus's death....as far as religion goes...I think we havent found a root cause...so if there is anyone living with paati find out....coz was talking to a malluhindu friend...she said only mallu brahmins remove thaali after husband's death...so if 2 practices are followed...wat is the reason behind it???
idhuku than may be appa & amma says rombha kelvi ketkathe :)....coz some questions may not have answers :(

I am still expecting someone to give his views...parkalam if he wud give us more knowledge on this topic :)

Thanks to everyone for ur views....Gokul go ahead with metti topic now :)

gokulan42
02-29-2004, 06:23 PM
Alright! Thanks for a wise decision, pattams. :dance: :clap:

Great arguments from the likes of Honeyarjun, Srini (RK) & others that I mentioned in my earliar posts and those I missed intentionally (Sagi & others ;) )

:wink: :cool: :yes: :clap: :wink: :cool: :yes: :clap: :wink: :cool: :yes: :clap:

Lets move on to metti and egg as veg debates :)

butterfly
02-29-2004, 11:24 PM
Just want to share certain points brought to my attention by my friend

Thaali pathi solraduku munadi Jayabhaskaranin oru kavithai nyabagam vardu...

Naanum Neeyum...

naamiruvarum sernthu eduththa padangkaLil narkaaliyil naan

adakkamaaka enakkup pinaal nindru kondirupaai NEE..

un inaththuk karpukarasikalai cholli unnai mirattuven naan

en inaththu ayogyargalin pattiyal therindum amaithiyaaga irupaai NEE...

nee enakkirupathai pirar ketalozhiya sollik kolvadillai naan

naan unakiruppathai aathaarangal aNindhu paraisaatriyaaga vendum NEE...

enakkup piRagu en ninaivugalodu vaazha vaikiraargal unnai

unakku piragu un thangaiyodu vaazha vaikiraargal ennai...

thaali epdi vandudu-ngradu modalla naama ketukanum...thamizharodathu nu konja per solranga... ariyans kondu vandadu nu konja per solranga...ariyans varaduku munadi irunda tamil culture pathi neraya infos illa... kurippa inda thaali pathi irukaa.. theriyadu... therinja varai thaali kattikitatha solranga... adu aryans vandaprom thaan...

general a thirumanam na yenna...? aanum pennum koodi vaazha seidukara oru agreement...oorla ullavangala saatchiya vachu serndrukradu... udal reedhiya serndukraduku oru samooga angeekaaram...avlo thane.. begining le aangalum penngalum mirugangal pola irundaanga.. ellarum yellarodayum serndirunthaanga... NerimuRai irukala...athunaala pala kulapangal.. sandaigal.. noigal lam vandudu ...oru kattupaadu venum.. oruvanuku oruthi nu neRimuRai venum nu Thirumanam.. mana oppantham...marriage vows... adayaalangal.... athan thaali,metti... thamizharin palaiya thirumana murai-a kuripidum sanga thamizh paadalgal...ipdi soludu...adhi kaalaiyil iyarkaiyaaga alangkarikkapatta Panthal-la... kulichu mangala pudavai anintha penn-a... maapillaiku pakathula kalyanam panni vaikradukune irukara kelavinga gang kooti vandu niruthuvaanga..pinaadi murasu olikka...maalai maathi... periyavanga munadi.. karpoda onna vaazhvom nu sabatham edupaanga...aduku aprom pookala ava koonthal la sootuvaanga... ring maathikra vazhakam kuda irundada solranga... thaali kattikradvum sila kurippugal iruku.. adu aryans vandaprom vandada...ila aduku munadi iruntheva- ngradu periya kelvi..! penngalai kalyanam panikra virumbara aangal...avanga aaNmaiya nirubikka,avanga vetai aadi konna puli,karadiyoda pall-a mangala kayithula thongura thaalila poatanga.. neruppu, thee ilama irukum thamizhar thirumanathula... agni satchi lam kedayathu.. athellam aryans vandaprom vandadu...

palaya thamizhar/dravidar vaazhndadu oru kaalathula mulu india & lemuria..aprom ipo irukara andhra,karnakataka,thamizh nadu,kerla.. pinadi aryans vandu conquer nama pannapo, konja konjama nilatha ilandu... deccan la mattum thangitom..thamizhargala sandai poatu vella mudiyatha aryans... vera madri nulanjaanga... aasuram,bramam,prajapatyam,ari dam,deivam,gandarvam,rakshadam ,paisasam nu neraiya thirumana muraigal sonanga..dowry vaangi kalyanam panradu.. thanuku thaane panikradu.. agni sakshiya panikradu..etc...
brahmins progithargala ulla vaandaanga.. thamizh penngala than thirumanam senjaanga.. adunaala than avanga agni satchi murai la... thaali ngra thamizhar muraiyayum serthu kittanga.. ithu namma ooruku vanda brahmins mattum than panraanga..north india la irunda aryans thaali vazhakam vachukala.. so adunaala ithu thamizharodathu thaan

ovvoru muraiyum dravidians foreign invasions thollai la kashta pattanga... apdi namma oora pudikravanga.. penngal karpai sooraiyaadunaanga... adula irundu thapika inda thaali udavichu.. inda penn thirumanamaanaval nu velinaatukaranuku
kaamikka thaali udavichu...

butterfly
02-29-2004, 11:35 PM
kalachara adayalangal yellam penngal than poatu kaatitu irukanum.. aangal yedum podrathilla.. podavai kattanum..pottu vaikanum...thalaiku poo vachukanum...golusu maatikanum... thaali podanum.. valaiyal podanum.. penngal naa ipdi than irukanum... nu ivanga yepdi mudivu panna mudiyum? inda thaali kattradu kattaathathu than oru ponna hus maranam adaindadhum widow athu ithu nu oru nilaiku thalludu... thaali arukanum bla bla... culture adu idu nu penngal mela than ella sumaiyum..thaaliya katti Ponna samayal kattula kattipotom... adane unmai...ippo padippu,velai nu vandaprom than penngal sindhika aarambichrukaanga.. thaali ngra murai penngal mela thinika patrukanum... illa anda muraiya ethukittapengal padipparivu atravargala irundrukanum.. adhu thodarndu 2000 yrs ku mela iruku.. oori poidichu.. ipo thideer nu thaali venam na.. adu padicha ponnaala kuda ethuka mudiyuma therla.. kalacharam athu ithu nu ipdi than munorgal valarthanga namma,namma amma appava,namma paati,thaatha va... 2000 yrs pazhakatha thideer nu vidu na mudiyatha onnu thavira ipo foreign invasions yedum illa... apdiye oru ponna karpazhika nenachalum ipo yaarum thaali iruka ilaiyanulaam pakradilla..apdi panna nenaikra saitan thaali irundalum panna than poran..ilanaalum...
mooda pazhaka vazhakangala udankattai eruradu..purushan setha udane ponnum avan kuda erinju saavuradu..mottai yadikradu... inda madri male-chauvinists kondu vanda pazhaka vazhakangal puratchi penngal vandu...ipo kitta thatta olinju poachu.. adu madri thaali kattikradum oru awareness vandu kaala pokula ozhinju poidum...thamizhar thaaligal vera vera madri vadivathula irukum... ovvoru jaathi, samayathuku yetra madri... sila oorla irukara muslim thamizhargal matra thamizhargal pola thaali kattikranga..aniku mattum athuku aprom atha poatutu alayuradu illa.. ithuve christianskum porundum...

vellaikaaran wedding la ring maathi avanukunu adayalam iruku.. namaku illaiye..

apdi namma kalacharatha kaapathanum nu nenaikravanga... ponnuku thaalikattrapove.. ponnu kaiyaala avangalum thaali vaangi kattikattum.. illa aduku samama.. thirumanamaanavan nu oru adalyam... karpu ngradu pennukum onnu thaan aanukum onnu thaan...thaali katta venam apdi ipdi nu lam sola maten... ovvorutharum yosinga..

any questions about history pls approach vasan & karki :)

Shy
03-01-2004, 12:59 AM
I was very much hesitating in my mind whether I should continue this heated debate...but am replying only for a healthy debate... I am sorry for my outrageous reply...but shy's post has offended me a bit.. so here I go with my response...

:wink: so eppadi ellam pannina u will be in a topic'a.. mm noted


C'mon ...pls dont generalize and order(or advice) people here to follow something.. If its your opinion..you can keep it to urself.. but pls remember others have differing opinions.. and what is the husband wearing for the token of love... why is it that only women should wear this token of love???

Did I mention anywhere, someone should follow something or do somethin here? I just said hwt our culture asks us to do.. Again its individuals thoughts to follow if they like it or not!!! Man yaethuvum wear panrathu ellainu yaar sonna.. theriyalaina ask out.. long back, they were wearing metti.. but as days passed it died !!!! So wifekku thaali mathiri husbands had metti.

If u dont want someone, obviously not me.. i mean the culture/traditions to show to lead a life, dont do it.. but athukaaga athu yaen eppadi solluthu, appadi soluthunu disect panaaatheenga...


No one is saying here that India is a country without culture.. We all agree and have the same opinion that India is great in its culture and traditions.. but do we need to have this preaching here????

I am NOT preaching stuff here, Also if I need I will, Thaalina oru kaayru sollaravangalukku, athooda important preaching mathiri iruntha just ignore it.. atleast therinchukanumnu nenaikaravanga therinchukalaamae !!!! Also as u say that u respect the culture and traditions of our country, then why is that u hate the way that its asking u to be????? I am not saying everything is the best.. but most of it!!!


Only if we wear thali..ponnu olunga vaalvalla enna???

Did I say that.. culture and traditiom, oru aalvaukku thaan will guide u in life, byshowing u whats worth and what not....also if she truly follows that.. athuku appuramum if she has the urge to do something that she like, then thats her problem... ellai naan 4 paeru kuuda thaan irupaenna.. appuram what can the culture do.. avalooda individual character appadi (sorry for being so green here) I shud mention something here, u know long back those bad girls used to wear somesort of stuff in their neck to be identified as them... but as years passed, athuvum poochu.. i recommed that.. appadi society paateetu irukanum if someone does a bad thingna.. ennaiku red/yellow/green areanu evalavu popular and profitable businessa irukumaa??? I didnt say it wont be there at all. but all i am saying is it would have not been a aala maram like now...


I am really sorry..I beg to differ from all the above.... Just because one says thali is an ornament , it doesnt mean that they are bad and follow wrong culture.. NO one here is so ignorant to our culture.. and we all respect it.. so pls reconsider your decision to call us unlucky to be Indians.. I am prould to be an Indian and respect my country..Just because I say thali is an ornament it doesnt mean that I am not fit to be an Indian...

I still stand by that... If u truly respect ur country it means u truly respect what the country offers u too and that is its culture and tradition. Again solraen... chumma child marriages, sati ellam solaatheenga..... never in any written epics or stuff of this.. inbetween sila loosunga.. twisted it.. but anyways I amnot saying 100% sutham namba culturena.. orus ila, like widows ellam treat panrathu thappu... that was too strict.. but athukaaga athu solra nalla vishyathai ellam oorankataatheenga !!


What ???? Thali prevents a woman from making mistakes.... The second she thinks some other person in her mind...the same minute she betrays her husband.. Relationship and betrayal are not only physical things..but mainly mental stuff..and If thali is the only thing thats going to save her.... c'mon its a just a matter of time.. God save the woman...

Thats true.. but think which can be reversable and which cannto be..!!!! Thats all matters in the end !!!


Finally ... Are the woman of India still wear sarees without blouses as that was the culture followed in early times..are the indians still walk and use horses for travel as that used to be the way long back?? Are we still walking with bare foot?? Are we still eating here in US in restaurants using hands as it is what followed in India?? I can give numerous examples.... am saying this why b'coz.... we change to situations... we try to live a practical life and we neednt have to close our eyes blindly and say ...our ancestors said this so me going to follow it blindly... Its like locking ourselves in a box and throwing away the key...

Common civilising ourselves better as years pass by has nothign to do with thaali.. yaen restuarantsla sapiduroom, veetula kaila thaanae sapidureenga??? even when u are in US, veetula functionsa we are doing it right.... athu mathiri follow pana mudiyaratha follow panrathula enna thaapu??? no one in is locking themselves and follwoing blindly, I believe what they had said abt thaali is true, so i am following it...


One last question for you shy... can u pls answer my question in my previous post..(will you say the same dialogues to the doc when u go to an operation theatre????)

Oops ithukku munnadi oru post irunthuthaa, naan pakalai.. but u know..there are doctors who respect ur belief.. sure i wont ask them to remove it and here in US they accept that ;)

Anyway guys, good talking with u all.. but i still stand with as i had said before :D.. venky sona mathiri than me too.. beleive panravanga panalaam, ellaina just u can proceed with ur life :b: :b: !!!

Gokul , irunga egg veggis topicla pakuraen ungalai !!!!

Shy

gokulan42
03-01-2004, 01:14 AM
Good try for a lost battle, Shy ;) I can give you proper replies to each and every statement of you. But, still we already won, I am not going to waste mu energy. Moreever, it may spoil my chances in metti debate ;)


Gokul , irunga egg veggis topicla pakuraen ungalai !!!!
Lets go. I am waiting. Good luck for you there ;) Try to win atleast that egg ;) *just kidding*

anainar
03-01-2004, 02:06 AM
What is a lost battle? Ippo thaan Shy has come in full swing with her sword. The topic is going to heat up only after this. Shy, how can you withdraw now?

Pattams,

Your history looks plausible, but what is questionable is whether those invaders who came to India and plundered our wealth really gave a damn about whether a lady was married or not. They are barbarians who left no stones unturned. Rajput women were known to kill themselves enmasse after those invasions because of brutal rapes. And that included married women too. So, that argument of thaali to identify oneself to a foreigner does not hold water.

Like I said, wearing a thaali more of personal preference now or when they go to elders house. With nuclear families of just husband and wife, that might not be happening always. Though women respect it, they may not be wearing it always. I dont know whether it will go out of practice anytime soon.

But you did not give any verdict yet. Are you saying women should not wear just because they have to wear saree, pottu vaikkarathu, ornaments podarathu? Ornaments are desires of women. No guy would want to invest money in gold because it is most Non Performing Asset. But women have such an affinity towards that yellow metal that every year they ear mark some money for gold. It is not forced by guys, but self desire of women.

Cheers

butterfly
03-01-2004, 03:39 AM
But you did not give any verdict yet. Are you saying women should not wear just because they have to wear saree, pottu vaikkarathu, ornaments podarathu? Ornaments are desires of women. No guy would want to invest money in gold because it is most Non Performing Asset. But women have such an affinity towards that yellow metal that every year they ear mark some money for gold. It is not forced by guys, but self desire of women.


anainar,
I wud consider Thaali bonding a man & women only if everyone accept it as true...& If thats the truth...then no women shud be asked to remove the thaali on the death of her husband...coz marraige is a bond which unites 2 souls...so something like thaali shudnt be telling or reminding them of their bond...but its has to come frm within...something spiritual...like there is no symbol connecting a mother to her child...but the bond is there...
This is just my opinion...its not to hurt anyone or advice anyone...

Honeyarjun
03-01-2004, 03:57 AM
Shy...I can argue taking your post point by point ...but I do not want to do that and make this thread a nasty one.. Also I give it back when people rub me on the wrong side.... Thats why I was outrageously responding and your post looked like it was aimed at me.. I can say it for sure as I was the only female who called thali an ornament.. But I also said trust is the only thing tht can bond 2 people together forever... u failed to see that and developed an opinion that I am against the Indian tradition ..culture etc .. I dont have explain and prove to others how I respect my country...

I want to end it here..if u want to continue... I am all set to go...and can answer your post taking each and every point..

Shy
03-01-2004, 04:01 AM
Good try for a lost battle, Shy ;) I can give you proper replies to each and every statement of you. But, still we already won, I am not going to waste mu energy. Moreever, it may spoil my chances in metti debate ;)


Gokul , irunga egg veggis topicla pakuraen ungalai !!!!
Lets go. I am waiting. Good luck for you there ;) Try to win atleast that egg ;) *just kidding*

Who told u that u won, just because there are more people with ur thoughts ????? :evil: :evil:

See I told my points and I dont want to make any more useless arguments here and hence said I am stopping , that doesnt mean I lose...remember!!!!

Shy

Shy
03-01-2004, 04:09 AM
Thats why I was outrageously responding and your post looked like it was aimed at me.. I can say it for sure as I was the only female who called thali an ornament..

Honeyarjun, I am not at all aiming at you here !!!, First please understand that and dont take it personally. Every person can have any opinions and have the right to stand by it and u did it. Patti mandram paathathu ellaiyaa neenga, Opponentai matum ellai avanga family'aiyum saethu kindal pannunvaanga and fight vigourlouly to make their point... This is just like that and no intentions behind it !!!! So again solraen dont take it personally !!!


But I also said trust is the only thing tht can bond 2 people together forever... u failed to see that and developed an opinion that I am against the Indian tradition ..culture etc .. I dont have explain and prove to others how I respect my country...

I truly accept that the point u said is very true... And I respect that.. But as an opponent, I got to invalidate what u say and make up my points right ??? Athai thaan sonaen.

Also Yes, no one needs to justify their patronitism or whatever here !!! avanga avanga mansaachi padi irunthaalae poothum :b: :b:


Shy...I can argue taking your post point by point ...but I do not want to do that and make this thread a nasty one.. Also I give it back when people rub me on the wrong side....

Thats a character everyone has !!!


I want to end it here..if u want to continue... I am all set to go...and can answer your post taking each and every point...

Yes I am ready too, but geethama oru battle fielda maatha vaendaam !!!

Shy

vasan
03-01-2004, 04:34 AM
Keep your shirt on guys... (i mean, don't yet get into the ring and throw punches..) or in other words, kopam vendamm.... please.. please, please... :pray: :pray: hmm.. May I endeavor to summarize and see what we have talked so far? Please bear with me..

We do have two or three prominent opinions: Let me see if I can summarize them, even if it has to be done only inadequately... (my inability to understand and paraphrase.. not the original authors!!)

1) That thaali is a sacred bond between a woman and her husband and that it reminds her of her commitment and keeps her life centered around her family. It has been tradition a in our country - a worthwhile tradition to follow. And it should be honored. Women ought to wear a thaali.

2) Its merely an ornament - no different from nose rings and ear rings. People can wear, not wear or change the style etc freely. You certainly don't have to wear it at all times. It does not remind us of the committment, and true love and loyalty comes from a person's mind and not from a trinket. Its a tradition, but not necessarily a meaningful one, and if you choose not to do it strictly, its OK.

3) A mixture of perhaps and perhaps not. If two people get married tying a thaali- they do it because they give importance to thaali.Why then should they remove it? Thaali is important only if everyone believes in it. If thaali is so important for the society, why then the same society takes it away from widows? Aren't their marriage eternal? Some treat it as a token of husbands love and cherish it. Some do attach a religious significance to it. And some feel no great meaning to it.

Was thaali always an indian tradition? Some have argued it. Pattampoochi has also written a bit about history from a Tamil's perspective- more about it like a practice of forefathers rather than as a strict thing people have laid down for future generations to practice.

What do we conclude?

1) For tamils alone or for every indian (except for indians of some religious beliefs) thaali is still a symbol of marriage. More or less. More so in Tamil Nadu.

2) Should then be made mandatory for every one to practice? NO. No one can impose on any one else. Can people still then consider it as sacred. ABSOLUTELY. Do one person consider the other lacking in tradition or practicing out dated values? NO WAY. Every one does objectify in some sense the purest of our emotions. Love and loyalty though springs from heart, still requires channels of material nature. It could be the rose a person buys for the other, or the dress, or a card/love letter or an iPod or a Lexus. Expression of love both to satisfy our own heart as well as to bring happiness to our loved ones is important. And if one person chooses to make such a gift, an expression of his/her love in the presence of their god, it is a great and wonderful thing to do. A bliss, indeed.

On the other hand, if you don't give into expression of your love in this way but choose your own way, you are not betraying your culture. You do certainly differ from its current version and practice of it. But in no way you walk away from your tradition. Why? Because the tradition is not merely in the expression of your loyalty or love - but in Loyalty and Love itself. How you choose to express it, is still under your choice. Its true most express it in terms of thaali, but if you want to do it other ways - remind each other of your love and give them a day at the Spa every month.. Well, certainly.

The main thing in Indian culture (though not solely ours alone, but for many others as well) is that sense of belonging to each other - husband to wife and wife to husband. To love and cherish. To devote and desire. To share and sacrifice. That had to be done. Its a tradition taught by the elders. Express it in the most common form of thaali, or be your own master and be creatively differnt in your expression. But follow them - ultimately thats what is gonna bring happiness at home.

I tried to read, understand and post the gist of what every one has been saying. I am sorry if I missed any salient points. As you notice, there are no winners or loosers, there are no modern view points or traditions - it only understanding the core values of our past, and inheriting and adapting the outward expressions of it - in the same form or in a much different version that is of paramount concern.

Thanks a bunch for your patience.

Honeyarjun
03-01-2004, 04:40 AM
Thanks for clarifying shy..sorry I misunderstood your post...
Had a good debate..( fight :wink: )..All ends well.. now butterfly can come and post the final verdict...

Bluelotus
03-01-2004, 04:41 AM
wow way to go dude.
I think u might just have got it all covered.

gokulan42
03-01-2004, 04:47 AM
Who told u that u won, just because there are more people with ur thoughts ????? :evil: :evil:
I consider this as a win when you guys dint have any argument to the solid evidence we gave on almost every single field (be it religious reasons, medical, ...). When pattams (the person who started the topic in the first place) concluded that thali is not mandatory to be worn all the time, I considered the win was sealed ;)


See I told my points and I dont want to make any more useless arguments here and hence said I am stopping , that doesnt mean I lose...remember!!!!Shy
Win or lose we stay at what we beleive. That does not change. And, you dont need to beleive all you said for the sake of debate and you do not need to say only those that you beleive. Its a debate and I just considered this as one and nothing more. BTW Shy, I dont remember that much when I win ;) :ee:

Lets stop this debate now and move to the metti where I change my skin there. Yes, I support metti there. My friend honeyarjun may be a opponent there and my opponent Shy would be a friend there. Its just politics guys ;)

RaasuKutty
03-01-2004, 04:51 AM
butterfly,

ur explanation post was good... it reminded me abt our history teacher explaining civilizations...

vasan,

u summarized well... consolidating different versions spanning miltiple pages... man.. good work....

Luv,
....Srini (RaasuKutty)

Honeyarjun
03-01-2004, 05:15 AM
vasan.....way to go man... :clap: ...I agree with each and every word you wrote..

Shy
03-01-2004, 04:17 PM
Good good Vasan !!!! :clap: :clap:

Honeyarjun !!! Glad u understood what i was trying to convey :)

Gokul, unga postkku thanniyaa reply panraen .. ;)

Shy

Shy
03-01-2004, 04:23 PM
I consider this as a win when you guys dint have any argument to the solid evidence we gave on almost every single field (be it religious reasons, medical, ...). When pattams (the person who started the topic in the first place) concluded that thali is not mandatory to be worn all the time, I considered the win was sealed ;)

First this is not pattimandram !!! Second butterfly is not a naduvaar. She tried to understand something and she did thats all !!! She trying to understand doesnt mean u won :lol: :lol: :lol:


Win or lose we stay at what we beleive. That does not change. And, you dont need to beleive all you said for the sake of debate and you do not need to say only those that you beleive. Its a debate and I just considered this as one and nothing more.

I dont debate just for the sake of debate. I talk and argue with what i believe, so Dont tell me this !!!!


BTW Shy, I dont remember that much when I win ;) :ee:

Yeah , I know that, not just when u are like this, but when u varuthufy too :lol: :lol: :lol:

Shy

gokulan42
03-01-2004, 04:45 PM
I dont debate just for the sake of debate. I talk and argue with what i believe, so Dont tell me this !!!!
Wow, I saw you are passionate about this. That is the reason I checked on you couple of days back whether you are hurt by my statements :) BTW, myself and my wife would come to an agreement (or debate) on which side we should take and then I will represent that side in geetham :)




BTW Shy, I dont remember that much when I win ;) :ee:

Yeah , I know that, not just when u are like this, but when u varuthufy too :lol: :lol: :lol:

Shy
Appadinna :Ksp: Tried my innocent face :ee: :ee:

See ya, yes in egg as veg (you are already joot there?) & metti (as a teammate I guess) :)

gokulan42
03-01-2004, 04:46 PM
Good summary, Vasan. Since Shy herslef accepted your summary, you dont need any more awards :)

anainar
03-01-2004, 05:44 PM
Vasan,
கடைசியா என்ன சொல்றீங்க? தாலி வேணுமா, வேண்டாமா? "Yes" or "No"?. :lol: Effects of watching the movie Rules Of Engagement yesterday where the lawyer insists on "yes" or "no".

But like you said the core value of husband-wife relationship is much more important than the symbolic expressions like thaali. I presume every lady reading this should not get upset when their hubbies/BF do not give a card/gift for valentine day or that long awaited gold necklace for your birthday. Those are also tokens of love and since "We love you the most", please dont get upset over tokens of love.

I dont mind taking Lexus or iPod as token of love though. "Mera pyaari bheevi, aap kither hai, ithar aajaayeiyee pleaseee". :lol:

Cheers.

dinesh
03-01-2004, 06:50 PM
அடச்சே....
I was hoping we will get to see another blockbuster here.....all the signs were pointing to it........but unfortunately everyone is pacified now :cry: you guys should have a bit more consideration to people like me as well. If you guys solve all problems without fights, what will we do for entertainment? :(

Sri, enna solre iththa ipdiye utturalaamaa? illa thiriyai enganaachum thoondivittu marupadiyum paththa vechuralaamaa? :sm12:

Disclaimer : Ladies, please don't beat me. Please. I have a tender heart. :ee: Or should that be a weak heart? :think:

butterfly
03-01-2004, 11:39 PM
vasan,
Thanks for summarizing the whole topic :sm08:



First this is not pattimandram !!! Second butterfly is not a naduvaar. She tried to understand something and she did thats all !!! She trying to understand doesnt mean u won

:D ...started as a discussion & ended up as a debate :)




அடச்சே....
I was hoping we will get to see another blockbuster here.....all the signs were pointing to it........but unfortunately everyone is pacified now you guys should have a bit more consideration to people like me as well. If you guys solve all problems without fights, what will we do for entertainment?


Sri, enna solre iththa ipdiye utturalaamaa? illa thiriyai enganaachum thoondivittu marupadiyum paththa vechuralaamaa?


Honey arjun,shy,reks,sagi & others....ellam kavanicheengala???....inge oruthar...bore adikutham....so patasu vangame freea Fireworks parkanumnu asai padraru...enna pannalam :think: :think:

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 03:19 AM
Pattams, ethukku matha ladies a thirippi koopidreengo? They are nice ladies and they wont fight again :ee:

Thala, mosampa nee :ee:

reks
03-02-2004, 06:24 AM
They will start fighting again


oru ladies issue'la ladies vida paenakarama sandai potutu, ippo pesratha paaru :evil:

indhu2000
03-02-2004, 06:49 AM
good topic & diff kind of thinking & thoughts!!! What is my opinion is "Thali" is nothing...
Whatever it is oru orutharukum diff kind of opinion irukku! Thali vendam solara girls mosamaana pengalum alla...thali venum solara girls nalavangalaum illa.."i mean thali-ya pottu yaamathara peoples-m irukaraanaga"
Girls-ku license-sa "Thali" podaringha..but guyz-sa marandhaatche...south Indians-oda tration pathi pesaravangha yein "Metti" poda marukaraangha? Appo girls mattum marraige atchunu license venum! Guyz-ku andha adaiyaalam edhumvum illaiyaa...???
Pls Tradition pathi pesaravangha nambha tration pathi fulla therinjikittu ungha karuthu solungha! Yellaame nambikaila dhaan irukku!!!

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 06:56 AM
Thali vendam solara girls mosamaana pengalum alla...thali venum solara girls nalavangalaum illa.."i mean thali-ya pottu yaamathara peoples-m irukaraanaga"

Appadi podungo, Indhu. Arumai. Thala, kalai kattuthuppa ;)



Girls-ku license-sa "Thali" podaringha..but guyz-sa marandhaatche...south Indians-oda tration pathi pesaravangha yein "Metti" poda marukaraangha? Appo girls mattum marraige atchunu license venum! Guyz-ku andha adaiyaalam edhumvum illaiyaa...???
Pls Tradition pathi pesaravangha nambha tration pathi fulla therinjikittu ungha karuthu solungha! Yellaame nambikaila dhaan irukku!!!
Indhu, I would expect those who talked traditions to comment whether they really know. Sorry I cant do it as I dint support the tradition here :)
Also, if you want to insist rather strongly that guys should wear metti, please visit the 'metti' topic and participate. I strongly agree with you on your metti comments.

And, Welcome to geetham :) :cool:

dinesh
03-02-2004, 08:13 AM
And, Welcome to geetham

aahaa.....ithellam solla arambichute.....vaazhthukkal.. :)

anainar
03-02-2004, 12:45 PM
Dinesh,

Aama, Guku voda "Krishna leelaigal" is so famous in Geetham now. Nijamaave "Gokulathu Kannan" thaan, who wants to be surround by Gopikas. :lol:

In 15 days he has crossed 600 posts and is vying with Suha for the number of posts per day. Atleast Suha asks 1000 questions, but our man's dialogues are full of "leelais"

Cheers

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 03:24 PM
Dinesh,

Aama, Guku voda "Krishna leelaigal" is so famous in Geetham now. Nijamaave "Gokulathu Kannan" thaan, who wants to be surround by Gopikas. :lol:
No no. I dont want to be surrounded by 'gopikas' :)

Shy
03-02-2004, 04:16 PM
Dinesh,

Aama, Guku voda "Krishna leelaigal" is so famous in Geetham now. Nijamaave "Gokulathu Kannan" thaan, who wants to be surround by Gopikas. :lol:

In 15 days he has crossed 600 posts and is vying with Suha for the number of posts per day. Atleast Suha asks 1000 questions, but our man's dialogues are full of "leelais"

Cheers

Very true, anainar !!!!

Gokul, Romba thanadakkam ungalukku, dont worry naanga onnum sola maatoom, accept the fact that u are the Modern Gokulathu kannan ;)

Shy

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 04:32 PM
Dinesh,

Aama, Guku voda "Krishna leelaigal" is so famous in Geetham now. Nijamaave "Gokulathu Kannan" thaan, who wants to be surround by Gopikas. :lol:

In 15 days he has crossed 600 posts and is vying with Suha for the number of posts per day. Atleast Suha asks 1000 questions, but our man's dialogues are full of "leelais"

Cheers

Very true, anainar !!!!

Gokul, Romba thanadakkam ungalukku, dont worry naanga onnum sola maatoom, accept the fact that u are the Modern Gokulathu kannan ;)

Shy
Ok ok. It took a lot of hardwork :ee:

But, 'gokulathil kannan' is reserved for minmini ;) And, I will not accept the award from anybody else :ahha: I will think about this 'Modern Gokulathu kannan' little more to decide on this. Is there any monetary award along with this ;)

anainar
03-02-2004, 04:37 PM
Why not Guku, you can come down to Iowa and collect my penny box. I dont know how much it has. But definitely a few dollars. :lol: :lol:

Cheers

Shy
03-02-2004, 04:49 PM
Why not Guku, you can come down to Iowa and collect my penny box. I dont know how much it has. But definitely a few dollars. :lol: :lol:

Cheers

Kurumbu anainar ungalukku :lol: :lol: :lol:

Shy

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 04:55 PM
Why not Guku, you can come down to Iowa and collect my penny box. I dont know how much it has. But definitely a few dollars. :lol: :lol:

Cheers

I am in Iowa too. Tell me where can we meet and I will come over there to pick up those 'few' dollars :)

indhu2000
03-02-2004, 05:03 PM
அம்மா

sri_gan
03-02-2004, 05:59 PM
Sri, enna solre iththa ipdiye utturalaamaa? illa thiriyai enganaachum thoondivittu marupadiyum paththa vechuralaamaa?


Naan intha topic vegu amaithiya irrunthathukku karaname :sm12: Side Track ezhuthathan.

This is purely a sidetrack::: Only thing missing in this topic :sm12:

Note: This is written just for fun and the way I perceive at some point, kochukathinga.

Ready aaa....


Guku - Enga ponnalum leelai illamal naan illai, naan illamal athu leelaiye illai. :sm12:

Vasan - Ellarum theliva ellam pesura mari irrukku enakku than onnum vilanga mattenguthu. Ellathium summarize pannitu padichu patha Greek mari irrukku :doh:

Shy - Yaara athu jeyichuttenu uthar vidurathu, yaarathu kuppai podurathu :sm12:

Reks - Naan yaaru pakamum sera matten.

Honey Arjun - Geetham le Ennaiyum sethukuranga aiyaaa :D

Arumuganinar - Ennakku possanikai odaikama irruntha seri, yaarukku odicha namakku enna. :D

Venky - Nalla points koduthtom mansukku nimathiya irruku.

SALI - Ithelam manasukkule irruka vendiyavisheyam ithai ethukku vellila sollanum. Naan enna sonnalum evanachum oruthan sandaikku nikiran. Pazhamozhi than namakku corrite.

Suha Papa - Enakkum thalikkum sambantham illaiye :dance:

RaasuKutty - CHANGE IS THE ONLY CONSTANT THING....., History venumla

dinesh
03-02-2004, 06:05 PM
Intha topic ini polachukkum :sm12:
naan pannalaamnu yosichitirunthen...nee pannite.....corner-la ethavathu seat gaaliya irukka? :)

sri_gan
03-02-2004, 06:07 PM
Naan ithanai neram intha topica enga irrunthenu nenache :sm12:

Shy
03-02-2004, 06:30 PM
Sri,

ithu nayama... Topic arambichavanga pathi onnumae solalai..

Yaen advice mazhai varumnnaa :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Just kidding ;)

Shy

Shy
03-02-2004, 06:49 PM
Left few purposefully ;) adding them

Dinesh : Appa killi vitaachu, kulanthai ala arambichuduchu, oora seat engae, Popcorn yaengae

Sri : enakku onnum theriyaathu Enakku onnum theriyaathu.. Naan oru vali pookaan, aana ella showlaiyum ora seat enakku thaan ;)

Shy

sri_gan
03-02-2004, 07:07 PM
Yaen advice mazhai varumnnaa



Naan sollanum nu than nenachen... Satchatha antha [glow=red:b2edb6d539]:evil:[/glow:b2edb6d539] yeee sonnathukku appuram ennakku yaaru advice panna mudiyum :sm12:...

Butterfly: Evanachum enna pathi pesattum, advice koduthe ala vaikiren :yes:.

oru sample advise:

Dei Naan kelvi keppen da, Anna evanum pathil solla kudathu, sonniyoo ithan adviseu.. :sm12:

indhu2000
03-02-2004, 08:17 PM
Gokulan, i searched metti topics in the recent topics..but its gone!!!

i'll ask u some question?? whos is started mangal suitra??? Its a old tradition..so we just contiuing that one..but guyz really forget...atlast mettiyum girls thalaiyil katitaangha...
What is reason for Thalli & Metti...????

Andha kalathilum guyz thalai nimirndhu nadapaangalaam & girls boomi manna paarthu nadapaangalaam...yeppozhudhu oru aan magan nimirndhu oru pennai paarkum pozhudhu andha penn thriumanam aanavalaa illaiyaa yendru thrindhu kola thali-yai paarthu therindhu kolvaanaam..
adhepol oru penn thanaku yedhir padhamaaga varum aan maganai , thirumanam aanavanaa illaiyaa yendru arindhu kolla andha metti paarthi therindhu kolvaalaam!!!
But what happened now a days????Its everything ultta...So..tell me about yr suggestion!

Regards / Indhu (A) Thamarai

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 08:22 PM
Naan intha topic vegu amaithiya irrunthathukku karaname :sm12: Side Track ezhuthathan.
Adhu unmaba. Naradhar nu solreya ;)


This is purely a sidetrack::: Only thing missing in this topic :sm12:
dint u notice a gunfire between 2 very popular personalities here ;)


Note: This is written just for fun and the way I perceive at some point, kochukathinga.

Ready aaa....

We beleive :)



Guku - Enga ponnalum leelai illamal naan illai, naan illamal athu leelaiye illai. :sm12:

Vasan - Ellarum theliva ellam pesura mari irrukku enakku than onnum vilanga mattenguthu. Ellathium summarize pannitu padichu patha Greek mari irrukku :doh:

Shy - Yaara athu jeyichuttenu uthar vidurathu, yaarathu kuppai podurathu :sm12:

Reks - Naan yaaru pakamum sera matten.

Honey Arjun - Geetham le Ennaiyum sethukuranga aiyaaa Very Happy

Arumuganinar - Ennakku possanikai odaikama irruntha seri, yaarukku odicha namakku enna. Very Happy

Venky - Nalla points koduthtom mansukku nimathiya irruku.

SALI - Ithelam manasukkule irruka vendiyavisheyam ithai ethukku vellila sollanum. Naan enna sonnalum evanachum oruthan sandaikku nikiran. Pazhamozhi than namakku corrite.

Suha Papa - Enakkum thalikkum sambantham illaiye :dance:

RaasuKutty - CHANGE IS THE ONLY CONSTANT THING....., History venumla

Sri, these are gems (except that comment on mine.. ofcourse). I am rolling over :uncontrollable laugh - we need to find an icon for that: Particularly that Shy & Reks & guru & and.. and ... almost every single comment ;)

However, being a critic, I would like to point out that you missed some very important characters like SRI, pattams, unique, thalai and so on. Please, complete the list :)

gokulan42
03-02-2004, 08:24 PM
Gokulan, i searched metti topics in the recent topics..but its gone!!!

i'll ask u some question?? whos is started mangal suitra??? Its a old tradition..so we just contiuing that one..but guyz really forget...atlast mettiyum girls thalaiyil katitaangha...
What is reason for Thalli & Metti...????

Andha kalathilum guyz thalai nimirndhu nadapaangalaam & girls boomi manna paarthu nadapaangalaam...yeppozhudhu oru aan magan nimirndhu oru pennai paarkum pozhudhu andha penn thriumanam aanavalaa illaiyaa yendru thrindhu kola thali-yai paarthu therindhu kolvaanaam..
adhepol oru penn thanaku yedhir padhamaaga varum aan maganai , thirumanam aanavanaa illaiyaa yendru arindhu kolla andha metti paarthi therindhu kolvaalaam!!!
But what happened now a days????Its everything ultta...So..tell me about yr suggestion!

Regards / Indhu (A) Thamarai

I will bring up the metti thead just for you. I am generally very helpful for ladies :ee:

indhu2000
03-02-2004, 08:37 PM
hahaaaa nalla comedy!!!!

sri_gan
03-02-2004, 10:45 PM
However, being a critic, I would like to point out that you missed some very important characters like SRI, pattams, unique, thalai and so on.


Naan intha topic le ore oru post than potten athukke Namma [glow=red:9fedc43928]:evil:[/glow:9fedc43928] pathil sollitanga...

Dinesh kku avngale sollitanga... I updated for butterfly with a special support from [glow=red:9fedc43928]:evil:[/glow:9fedc43928]

Unique: Avanga eppavume unique than... [glow=red:9fedc43928]:evil:[/glow:9fedc43928] than avanga pera solliduvanga athai naan pathuruven appuram vega vegama unique athai pathutu.. pera edukka solli solluvanga :sm12:

sagi
03-03-2004, 05:49 AM
SALI - Ithelam manasukkule irruka vendiyavisheyam ithai ethukku vellila sollanum. Naan enna sonnalum evanachum oruthan sandaikku nikiran. Pazhamozhi than namakku corrit

evanda avan enna pathi eluthinathu AK47 theriyumla...

sri_gan
03-03-2004, 04:10 PM
Seri, I will make the Main Track Back on....

Thaali:

(1) This preserves tradition and it does plays a major role in a life who want to experience a family value.

(2) Ooru oorukku love pannalam nu tamilnaatu ponnunga sonnalum to an extent they are aware this protects their life. No one can deny this fact. Who will deny a secured life?

(3) Ennathana Pazhiya Culture athu ithunu pesunalaum, Arranged Marriage naala than ithu vanthuchu. Ithu mari innonu varanum nu than ninaika mudiyum... innonu vara mudiyathu. :D

SALI SIDE TRACK:::

AK47 = Aatu Kutti 47 aaaa? :sm12:

Shy
03-03-2004, 04:51 PM
Gokul, Sri and Others

I think u all will understand the privacy everyone needs even though its a public forum. So by mistake if u had known the name , please dont play with it. I know sri doesnt do like that, gokul ungalukku thaan solraen.. please dont ever try that again without the permission of the person ur playing with!!!! . I have removed those posts!!!!

Unique, Sorry abt that !!!!

Shy

katteri
03-03-2004, 05:27 PM
So tamil padathu nall oru kathai kiadaikkum pola irukku #


Thalikkul ivalavu vishayamaaaaaaaaaaa

gokulan42
03-04-2004, 05:18 AM
Gokul, Sri and Others

I think u all will understand the privacy everyone needs even though its a public forum. So by mistake if u had known the name , please dont play with it. I know sri doesnt do like that, gokul ungalukku thaan solraen.. please dont ever try that again without the permission of the person ur playing with!!!! . I have removed those posts!!!!

Unique, Sorry abt that !!!!

Shy
I am a nice guy and I try to reach over and adjust & flexible and all. And, I like geetham here & all the good people here. But, I dont bent over backwards. I dont take this comment of yours nicely. But, I swallow it because a small part of the blame is mine. Yes, I used part of her name.

gokulan42
03-04-2004, 02:33 PM
(2) Ooru oorukku love pannalam nu tamilnaatu ponnunga sonnalum to an extent they are aware this protects their life. No one can deny this fact. Who will deny a secured life?

(3) Ennathana Pazhiya Culture athu ithunu pesunalaum, Arranged Marriage naala than ithu vanthuchu. Ithu mari innonu varanum nu than ninaika mudiyum... innonu vara mudiyathu. :D

I may have some comments on love vs arranged marriages. We should discuss that in a new topic. There are so many love marriages that happen with thali and it plays a significant role there too. And there are so many political marriages, inter religious marriages (all arranged I mean) happening without thali and other hindu traditions.

sri_gan
03-04-2004, 02:38 PM
I may have some comments on love vs arranged marriages. We should discuss that in a new topic. There are so many love marriages that happen with thali and it plays a significant role there too. And there are so many political marriages, inter religious marriages (all arranged I mean) happening without thali and other hindu traditions


We already had a very hot topic called Arranged Marriage and Love Marriage, My stand is always for Arranged Marriage and I have solid reasons.

Shy
03-04-2004, 03:06 PM
I am a nice guy and I try to reach over and adjust & flexible and all. And, I like geetham here & all the good people here. But, I dont bent over backwards. I dont take this comment of yours nicely.

Everybody here is for fun in this tensed up world, but still want their own privacy. So even u had known abt them, its not appropriate to play with it and create a curosity atmosphere. Thats all I am trying to imply here. nothing had to do with u, i mean we all know u are a nice outward ;) guy even though only towards gal :sm12: :sm12:!!!!.

Not just you, whoever here, not just likes but loves geetham and hence they are here. Whether you are taking whatever said as a good or bad, I dont mind. Coz at situations like this, I only mind about the person whose being played with here!!!!


But, I swallow it because a small part of the blame is mine. Yes, I used part of her name

You only did and thats all mattered. Unknowingly if you had then thats different ;).

Arranged/Love Marriage'a.. Sri opponent angae naan thaan ;) Entha team neengo ???

Shy

gokulan42
03-04-2004, 03:23 PM
I am a nice guy and I try to reach over and adjust & flexible and all. And, I like geetham here & all the good people here. But, I dont bent over backwards. I dont take this comment of yours nicely.

Everybody here is for fun in this tensed up world, but still want their own privacy. So even u had known abt them, its not appropriate to play with it and create a curosity atmosphere. Thats all I am trying to imply here. nothing had to do with u, i mean we all know u are a nice outward ;) guy even though only towards gal :sm12: :sm12:!!!!.

Not just you, whoever here, not just likes but loves geetham and hence they are here. Whether you are taking whatever said as a good or bad, I dont mind. Coz at situations like this, I only mind about the person whose being played with here!!!!
I dont care what you mind what you not. But, I care for personas who are any way affected by my quotes and I also care for what is portrayed here on me. And, I dont take what was said as good. I used part of the name and I sent PMs to both of them asking whether it hurt in anyway and I was willing to act (edit the post & apology obviously) on it. So, you cannot simply claim that without that persons permnission, I am playing (as if I am a villain here) and thus you are getting way too childish. I have seen this particular person's 'full' name being used in other threads.




But, I swallow it because a small part of the blame is mine. Yes, I used part of her name

You only did and thats all mattered. Unknowingly if you had then thats different ;).
I dont want to lie - not in my blood I guess. I would not have sent 2 pms to both these persons (who were really involved) explaing and offering what I can do, if its 'unknowingly'.

Next time when you say things in public about me, just PM me to check the facts from my side. I guess I can expect little courtesy of being active here.



Arranged/Love Marriage'a.. Sri opponent angae naan thaan ;) Entha team neengo ???

Shy
then I pick Arranged marriage.

sri_gan
03-04-2004, 03:39 PM
Arranged Marriage / Love Marriage Topic kalai kattum pola irrukku.

Ellathukkum karanam naan than, I shouldn't written the Side track::: thevai illama ezhuthiten pola irrukku :sm18: .

SHY and Gokulan Santham Kolga... Amaithi.. :pray:

gokulan42
03-04-2004, 04:00 PM
Sri, I dont find that topic.
Can you please bring up that thread? I would very much debate there :)

BTW, I enjoyed those comments, They were simply great and we needed it at that time :)

Cheers

Shy
03-04-2004, 04:05 PM
I dont care what you mind what you not. But, I care for personas who are any way affected by my quotes and I also care for what is portrayed here on me. And, I dont take what was said as good. I used part of the name and I sent PMs to both of them asking whether it hurt in anyway and I was willing to act (edit the post & apology obviously) on it. So, you cannot simply claim that without that persons permnission, I am playing (as if I am a villain here) and thus you are getting way too childish. I have seen this particular person's 'full' name being used in other threads.

I dont care what you think of what i had mentioned and how u take it. Also its not my job here to portray someone!!!. The particualr person's name was written in a post by mistake and was edited immediately, coz it was used not for fun or to play, but by mistake!!!! Also Even though they had said they didnt get hurt, the post wasnt left as such, but edited.


Next time when you say things in public about me, just PM me to check the facts from my side. I guess I can expect little courtesy of being active here.

Gokul, single post yaelutheetu poora personkitayum naan eppadi thaan soli irupaen, also to sri, madhu or anyone for that matter I know here. About the facts, its not whether u had asked them if its ok with them that u had used their name in the topic. It would have been great that before using their name, u could have PMed and asked them if you can. Athuku appuram'um naan eppadi public'la yaelutheena then ask me!!!!.


then I pick Arranged marriage.

Thats good !!!!

Shy

Shy
03-04-2004, 04:09 PM
Arranged Marriage / Love Marriage Topic kalai kattum pola irrukku.

Kandeepa.. Last time vacation poiteenga :evil:, Entha time theres no escape ;)


Ellathukkum karanam naan than, I shouldn't written the Side track::: thevai illama ezhuthiten pola irrukku :sm18: .

Uday vilum eppo yaaruko. I loved that side track!!! Super'a irunthathu !!!! :P Only :cry: thing is naraiya paerai u missed who were actually in the oora seat watching!!!!

Shy

gokulan42
03-04-2004, 04:11 PM
When I read that you dont care what I think, I stopped reading your post after that. Also, if you dont care what I think, why should you respond to my post. This I will never understand.

sri_gan
03-04-2004, 04:23 PM
Seri Seri....Allarum Calm down... illains Suha papa kitta solli koduthiruven amma sollipitten

Show your intensity without out personal in the Arranged Marriage vs Love Marriage

It is a 10 page Topic:

Link:

http://www.geetham.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3327

Shy
03-04-2004, 06:18 PM
When I read that you dont care what I think, I stopped reading your post after that. Also, if you dont care what I think, why should you respond to my post. This I will never understand.

Yeah same with me :think: :think: , when u said, quote "I dont care what you mind what you not " and still answered my posts :lol: :lol: :lol:

Shy

gokulan42
03-05-2004, 02:22 AM
Oh yaah. Its going full flow now both ways. Lets settle this in a peaceful way in love/arrange topic :)

Unique, I apologize for using the first tamil letter of your name. As I mentioned in my PM, it is a stupid one. Consider that I forgot your name now.

In a lighter note, I would add that I said 'I dint care what you mind' not 'I dont care what you wrote about me'. I am not that mad at you now. But, I will still be furious to win the love/arrange topic to dislodge any remaining grudge against you :)

Shy
03-05-2004, 03:33 AM
Gokul, sorry if I had hurt u in anyway. I just wanted unqiue not to loose the privacy, which she might need as well we do, so was bit out of my way !!!!

Sure kandeepa Arranged marriage'la irukara medhi kovam ellam kotidunga, will start afresh together in some new topic later ;)

Shy

gokulan42
03-05-2004, 03:41 AM
Gokul, sorry if I had hurt u in anyway. I just wanted unqiue not to loose the privacy, which she might need as well we do, so was bit out of my way !!!!

Sure kandeepa Arranged marriage'la irukara medhi kovam ellam kotidunga, will start afresh together in some new topic later ;)

Shy
Its ok and its past now. I guess we both had our human moments :)

Sure about the new topic, Shy :yes:

Now back to arranged/love debate.

sri_gan
03-05-2004, 03:53 AM
Ithu Goodu :yes:

butterfly
03-05-2004, 10:31 PM
sri wrote


Butterfly: Evanachum enna pathi pesattum, advice koduthe ala vaikiren .

oru sample advise:

Dei Naan kelvi keppen da, Anna evanum pathil solla kudathu, sonniyoo ithan adviseu..


Thanks sri...didnt know it was so powerfull :)...now can try it on others...better than poosanika :)...coz poosanikas are getting expensive ;)...& that reminds me to catch shidinesh & U for side tracking this topic...irungo iruku for both of u ...

anjaligirl
03-07-2004, 08:52 PM
OK to me a Thali is just like a wedding ring. If you marrid the guy wear teh dam thali but is he wearing a wedding ring? They both should hold the same values. Why isnt there somethign in our culture to signify that they guy is married?

anjaligirl
03-07-2004, 08:52 PM
OK to me a Thali is just like a wedding ring. If you marrid the guy wear teh dam thali but is he wearing a wedding ring? They both should hold the same values. Why isnt there somethign in our culture to signify that the guy is married?

chitracheenu
04-08-2004, 08:00 PM
Why do u say thaali is important and should be worn by ladies all the time. I have seen most north Indian ladies dont wear thaalis all the time except when they go for a party or to their in-laws place. It's like an ornament and not a license key.

Shy
04-08-2004, 09:04 PM
CC,

North Indian culture is entirely different.. Entha 3 knots antha concept ellam ellai.. Also angae thali is not given that importance :)

Namba oorula vachu sollungo :)

Shy

chitracheenu
04-08-2004, 09:12 PM
naan naria namma oru penkalayum paarthu irukirein.. thaali avuthu vaikiraanga.. manasukulla purushan irundha podhum adha thaali moolam theriya paduthanum kedaiyaadhu

gokulan42
04-09-2004, 02:10 PM
Exactly chitra.... We already 'won' the debate that thali is not mandatory :b:

chitracheenu
04-09-2004, 08:49 PM
accha namakku thaan eppothum vetri vetri vetri..

vennai1
04-09-2004, 11:14 PM
Exactly chitra.... We already 'won' the debate that thali is not mandatory




In life we give respect to certain stuff and attach a little value to them!

the respect to thaali comes from the bond called marriage...

yeah...well as you say you donot need a thaali for marriage...

afterall you dont even need a concept of marriage...

just stay together... rite ! :P

chitracheenu
04-10-2004, 12:05 AM
vennai!! enakkum indha american concept romba pidikum..oruthar oruthi kulla nalla understanding irundha adhuvey aayiram thaaliku samam..